D&D 5E You Roll Low, Nothing Happens. Can this/should this be changed?

[Brute]

Just wanted to let you guys know that not only will I be checking out Dungeon World but I'll be implementing some changes in my D&D 5e game as well. I love the idea of chits posted by Neechen, and I'm also considering alternate bonuses (on a miss you can get a free aid another to help the party, or perhaps on a miss you can choose to hit - but they hit you as well).

Love these ideas, and for my group these little tweaks are just right - but I understand that not everyone's porridge is "just right!"

Thanks again, really pleased with the helpfulness of the replies.

 

[Manbearcat]

Just wanted to let you guys know that not only will I be checking out Dungeon World but I'll be implementing some changes in my D&D 5e game as well.

I've GMed a ton of DW in real life and as PBP so I can answer any questions you have about the system (via PM or here or wherever). DW and 4e are my go-to games for D&D (each filling their own specific niche). Neither system is compatible with 5e so I would very much recommend against trying to do a DW and 5e mash-up. Metaplot-intensive, setting-intensive, heavy-handed GMing (especially GM force, fiat, and the requirement of GM adjudication of complex rules interactions) as primary facilitators of play is actually anathema to DW. If your players are expecting, or want, that, then you shouldn't bother yourself with it. But if they aren't looking for any of those things, and are looking for something else, then just give the system a spin on its own with your group and see how you guys like it.

Here is a DW PBP I'm running if you want to read it through and get a feel for the sort of fiction that it is supposed to produce and how the play procedures and overall agenda engender that sort of emergent play.

 

[SirAntoine]

I'd recommend fumbles on a natural 1, and for every three consecutive misses that may be fumbles or just misses, the character loses confidence and takes a -1 penalty to attacks and saving throws for the rest of the encounter.

 

[Rune]

I've GMed a ton of DW in real life and as PBP so I can answer any questions you have about the system (via PM or here or wherever). DW and 4e are my go-to games for D&D (each filling their own specific niche). Neither system is compatible with 5e so I would very much recommend against trying to do a DW and 5e mash-up. Metaplot-intensive, setting-intensive, heavy-handed GMing (especially GM force, fiat, and the requirement of GM adjudication of complex rules interactions) as primary facilitators of play is actually anathema to DW.

Huh. I wouldn't consider any of that to be requisite to 5e (well, SOME adjudication, but never a distracting amount--and, let's face it, DW requires plenty of fiat in the form of translating mechanical results into narrative). But, then, I've pretty much been running D&D by DW's GM principles for multiple editions, now (some more than others). Of course, DW is the best version of DW, but that certainly doesn't mean that 5e can't resemble it.

 

[Rune]

I'd recommend fumbles on a natural 1, and for every three consecutive misses that may be fumbles or just misses, the character loses confidence and takes a -1 penalty to attacks and saving throws for the rest of the encounter.

That seems very punitive to a character who is already having a bad day. What is gained here? Longer fights? More frustration?

This is the opposite of the "fail forward" approach that the OP seems to be looking for.

 

[SirAntoine]

That seems very punitive to a character who is already having a bad day. What is gained here? Longer fights? More frustration?

This is the opposite of the "fail forward" approach that the OP seems to be looking for.

I would like them if I were playing. I didn't quite grasp the "fail forward" direction of the thread. I'm sorry.

 

[Rune]

I would like them if I were playing. I didn't quite grasp the "fail forward" direction of the thread. I'm sorry.

No need to appologize! Your contribution is a contribution, after all. I can see its place in a game with themes of hopelessness, for instance. Ravenloft, perhaps.

 

[Manbearcat]

Huh. I wouldn't consider any of that to be requisite to 5e (well, SOME adjudication, but never a distracting amount--and, let's face it, DW requires plenty of fiat in the form of translating mechanical results into narrative). But, then, I've pretty much been running D&D by DW's GM principles for multiple editions, now (some more than others). Of course, DW is the best version of DW, but that certainly doesn't mean that 5e can't resemble it.

I think we probably disagree on what GM fiat means then. I'm meaning it as "the unbound authority to impose an arbitrary (personal whim - presumably informed in the moment by whatever play priority the GM holds as paramount) decree upon the fiction." That very much represents an AD&D 2e and 5e GMing ethos but in no way resembles the Dungeon World GMing ethos. The Dungeon World GMing macro-agenda and the micro-principles (which inform GM-side play procedures) are extremely bounded/constrained, transparent, and are synthesized intimately with the fiction-first approach, the basic resolution mechanics, and the PC builds/xp feedback system. They couldn't be less "personal whim" or "unbound authority". They are tightly constrained and externally focused.

I've done a few posts very recently here and here on tracking in both 5e and Dungeon World that I think illustrate the pretty extreme difference between the two in play (from a GMing perspective). That is just the micro-conflict of tracking. Extrapolate that out with pretty much everything and the difference becomes vast.

 

[I'm A Banana]

I've GMed a ton of DW in real life and as PBP so I can answer any questions you have about the system (via PM or here or wherever). DW and 4e are my go-to games for D&D (each filling their own specific niche). Neither system is compatible with 5e so I would very much recommend against trying to do a DW and 5e mash-up. Metaplot-intensive, setting-intensive, heavy-handed GMing (especially GM force, fiat, and the requirement of GM adjudication of complex rules interactions) as primary facilitators of play is actually anathema to DW. If your players are expecting, or want, that, then you shouldn't bother yourself with it. But if they aren't looking for any of those things, and are looking for something else, then just give the system a spin on its own with your group and see how you guys like it.

Here is a DW PBP I'm running if you want to read it through and get a feel for the sort of fiction that it is supposed to produce and how the play procedures and overall agenda engender that sort of emergent play.

Man, I dunno if I'd characterize 5e like that, and I don't know if I'd agree that DW and 5e are so precious that they can't be smooshed together rather effectively in some circumstances.

But I would recommend if the OP is into it to just give DW a try on its own. If nothing else, it'll be an interesting variant!

 

[keterys]

Getting a minor bonus (ex: a bonus the next time you attack, a bonus to defenses, etc) on miss could be interesting.