TSR Q&A with Gary Gygax

This is the multi-year Q&A sessions held by D&D co-creator Gary Gygax here at EN World, beginning in 2002 and running up until his sad pasing in 2008. Gary's username in the thread below is Col_Pladoh, and his first post in this long thread is Post #39.

 

[Gentlegamer]

Of course, they no longer have effective consumer interest/loyalty-building support vehicles such as GenCon, the magazines, and an active RPGA, so it seems doubtful to me that there will ever be a campaign to recruit new persons to the RPG hobby. Likely that conceptis totally foreign to Hasbro.

My first introduction to D&D was the cartoons, then I found the Endless Quest books, then I found Dragon magazine (in my local library!).

I gamed "vicariously" through Dragon for a couple years (playing a "no rules" D&D with a friend in middle-school) before I found the D&D basic set (big black box). I had tried playing with the AD&D Player's Handbook (Zeb the Destroyer edition), but it really didn't explain the "whole picture" of playing the game enough . . . the basic set did. I was able to teach myself and my friends how to play.

I guess what I'm saying is that my experience testifies to exactly what you said. Without those entry points to the game, I may never have become a RPG gamer.

 

[tylerthehobo]

Just so...

It disturbs me considerably that WotC is not actively seeking to expand the participant base for the D&D game by the means I noted. TSR expended a lot of effort in this regard, and it was quite successful. WotC has the means that TSR had, and no campaign has been launched.

Cheers,
Gary

Yep, not to drag the discussion out past what you've already laid out as the endgame, but I look around the shop sometimes when a newbie comes in to join a game that they see underway, and when they ask "Can I play?" it should be simpler. If I hand somebody a character sheet (whether they're 12 or 30), I've got to halt play 5-10 minutes to explain it to them, or hope that one of the other players can coach them well enough block by block, as we go along.

I'm wondering if the new online editions of Dragon and Dungeon are intended in WotC's mind to speak to that World-of-Warcraft demographic, but let's be real - the 10-16 year old bracket that should be marketed to for the game aren't going to be sitting around online reading about the game - they want a "turnkey" intro game that they can play. Heck, even if they made a free online edition of the basic game that allowed for multiple visits through different scenarios and classes, so that new players could get exposure to how the game works, in a medium that they're familiar with, that'd be a great start. (And yes, I'm familiar with the "intro to d&d" onesie that you can "play" via flash on the WotC website - I'm talking about something of a larger scale.)

(end grump)

 

[NewJeffCT]

WotC should be marketing an introdctory boxed D&D game at a low pirchase price, this work designed to interest the participant in expanding the game into the full-blown D&D offering--most easily by acquiring additional sets as was done with Original D&D. Of course, they no longer have effective consumer interest/loyalty-building support vehicles such as GenCon, the magazines, and an active RPGA, so it seems doubtful to me that there will ever be a campaign to recruit new persons to the RPG hobby. Likely that conceptis totally foreign to Hasbro.

Cheerio,
Gary

I agree 100% with that - way back around 1979 or 1980 or so, I purchased the original Basic boxed set along with "Keep on the Borderlands" - that got me into gaming when I was 13 or 14 years old. (or was that 1981? I forget) - but, from there, I moved up to "Advanced D&D" and the hardcover PHB, Monster Manual & DMG. I think the original boxed set was lost over time, but I still have my original dice (my d20 is almost round now it's been used so much... and, since it seems to land on "2" an inordinate amount of times, it's been retired)

And, I know others around my age that got into gaming the same way - through that old Basic set. I think with the popularity of fantasy like the recent "Lord of the Rings" movies, as well as the Harry Potter books & movies and the Eragon books, it seems like an effort should be made towards those kids that are in the 12-18 years old range. If you could get just 1 in 50 or 1 in 100 of the readers in that range to play D&D, it would definitely boost the hobby for the long-term.

 

[ragboy]

There is a "basic" version of the current D&D game out there, and it's for sale at toy stores and general retailers - at least online. I haven't seen it in the wild, but then I haven't looked that closely either.

We have both versions, and, as alluded to, it's basically a one-shot adventure with some pre-made characters and not much attention paid to how to do anything in the game. It's less a "miniatures" game, though, which surprised me. Definitely not like Descent. I don't know if you've actually played, but Descent is rather complicated, mostly because you have to keep track of handful of different tokens.

The "Player's Kit" wasn't much better. It includes a soft-bound 3.5 Players' handbook and a summary of the rules. The basic game loosely connects to some of WotC's intro modules (Howling Horde, most notably), but there's nothing like the Basic->Expert->etc. of the old basic game.


Col. Pladoh is right, of course. I'd like to see C&C or this new OSRIC push produce a full basic game that ties directly in with the more complex game rules, market it...hell give it away for almost free... tie it in with a computer version (where you need both to play, or something).

 

[thedungeondelver]

We have both versions, and, as alluded to, it's basically a one-shot adventure with some pre-made characters and not much attention paid to how to do anything in the game. It's less a "miniatures" game, though, which surprised me. Definitely not like Descent. I don't know if you've actually played, but Descent is rather complicated, mostly because you have to keep track of handful of different tokens.

The "Player's Kit" wasn't much better. It includes a soft-bound 3.5 Players' handbook and a summary of the rules. The basic game loosely connects to some of WotC's intro modules (Howling Horde, most notably), but there's nothing like the Basic->Expert->etc. of the old basic game.


Col. Pladoh is right, of course. I'd like to see C&C or this new OSRIC push produce a full basic game that ties directly in with the more complex game rules, market it...hell give it away for almost free... tie it in with a computer version (where you need both to play, or something).

Then Wizards of the Coast has failed the most fundamental hurdle jump in keeping D&D viable.

 

[Geoffrey]

I'd like to see C&C or this new OSRIC push produce a full basic game that ties directly in with the more complex game rules, market it...hell give it away for almost free... tie it in with a computer version (where you need both to play, or something).

The C&C Basic Set is coming out later this year:
http://www.trolllord.com/newsite/cnc/8951.html

 

[jdrakeh]

I'd like to see C&C or this new OSRIC push produce a full basic game that ties directly in with the more complex game rules, market it...hell give it away for almost free...

You may want to look at the Basic Fantasy RPG, which is, in many ways, to the current edition of D&D what the original Basic Set was to AD&D. And, yes, it's free -- but also available as a hardcover book or a perfect-bound softcover (both relatively inexpensive).

 

[Col_Pladoh]

Beginner's sets are all well and good. Promoting and marketing such material is the key to their success in attracting new participants to the RPG hobby. WotC does not have an entry level game for newbies, and they have no advertising and promotion campaign aimed at bringing in new blood.

It seems to me that instead of doing so they plan to go after the CRPG player market, those that are into playing WoW and the like. Perhaps I am mistaken. Time will tell.

Cherio,
Gary

 

[haakon1]

Heck, even if they made a free online edition of the basic game that allowed for multiple visits through different scenarios and classes, so that new players could get exposure to how the game works, in a medium that they're familiar with, that'd be a great start.

I dunno about free, but Temple of Elemental Evil the computer game was awesome, used real (OK, 3e) rules, and was relatively easy for noobs to figure out.

I have no clue why DDO doesn't use real D&D rules (of any edition) . . . I guess they think CRPG players won't go for encumbrance limits, need for sleep and healing, and need for a party to survive . . .

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

Hi Gary,

I'm sure you've answered this before and I have my own take on the subject, but a recent post on another forum prompted me to get your take.

Why were half-orcs included as a "core" race in 1E AD&D? Are their origins meant to be grounded in rape? If so, was this incidence common enough to warrant a complete race (with population data IIRC in the GH material)? Or was there another origin that the 1E PHB didn't go into?

Thanks!