D&D (2024) Warlock Dips

[MarkB]

So, one thing about the playtest Warlock that hasn't received much attention in the shadow of its more controversial features is that, depending upon your pact boon, you can now use Charisma, Wisdom or Intelligence as your primary spellcasting stat. That makes a number of potential multiclassing options more viable, and with Eldritch Invocations still coming in at 2nd level, a 1-2 level dip in this class seems like it could be pretty tasty.

Looking at the three Pact spells, they all have some level-dependent aspect, with Pact Familiar looking the most level-dependent, relying upon Warlock levels for both HP and damage, and its long-range scouting/messenger ability locked behind 5th level. Still, it could be of great use situationally.

Pact Weapon only has Extra Attack level-gated, every other aspect of it is available at first level.

With Book of Shadows, the level-gated part is that from 5th level you effectively gain Agonising Blast on all your cantrips. That aside, it's a neat way to gain access to some cantrips and 1st-level spells that you wouldn't normally be able to, and change them out at an hour's notice.

All that said, I'm no expert on multiclassing, so I'll throw this open. With three primary stats to choose from, what classes could benefit from a Warlock dip - or vice versa - that wouldn't have been viable with the 2014 version?

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Bladelock Extra Attack and multiple Eldritch Blast beams scaling with warlock levels pretty much eliminates any warlock dip that would want to use these features, they just don't keep up at higher levels.

Outside of dips, Warlock 5/Clerix X could be a fun ersatz Paladin, since it would have access to the same Smite spells as the Paladin does, and only needs WIS for attacks and spellcasting.

 

[Mirrorrorrim]

So, one thing about the playtest Warlock that hasn't received much attention in the shadow of its more controversial features is that, depending upon your pact boon, you can now use Charisma, Wisdom or Intelligence as your primary spellcasting stat. That makes a number of potential multiclassing options more viable, and with Eldritch Invocations still coming in at 2nd level, a 1-2 level dip in this class seems like it could be pretty tasty.

Looking at the three Pact spells, they all have some level-dependent aspect, with Pact Familiar looking the most level-dependent, relying upon Warlock levels for both HP and damage, and its long-range scouting/messenger ability locked behind 5th level. Still, it could be of great use situationally.

Pact Weapon only has Extra Attack level-gated, every other aspect of it is available at first level.

With Book of Shadows, the level-gated part is that from 5th level you effectively gain Agonising Blast on all your cantrips. That aside, it's a neat way to gain access to some cantrips and 1st-level spells that you wouldn't normally be able to, and change them out at an hour's notice.

All that said, I'm no expert on multiclassing, so I'll throw this open. With three primary stats to choose from, what classes could benefit from a Warlock dip - or vice versa - that wouldn't have been viable with the 2014 version?

First, I am going to provide feedback to open all 3 mental ability scores for each Pact Boon. Pact of the Tome should include Charisma for those who like playing Charisma Tomelocks. I specifically want to play an Intelligent Bladelock. And why not a Wisdom Chainlock?

Bladelock is going to be the most useful dip, if for nothing else that it lets a Mental ability-focused character use their primary ability score for their Pact Weapon. Bards, Clerics, Druids, and Paladins can really benefit from the pact blade if they don't want to focus on Str or Dex. It'd be cool for a Draconic Sorcerer with high AC that wants to mix it up.

I don't see myself dipping for the Familiar or the Tome.

 

[tetrasodium]

. With three primary stats to choose from, what classes could benefit from a Warlock dip - or vice versa - that wouldn't have been viable with the 2014 version?

Most of them. Especially any that focus on int wis or cha enough to have thirteen or more in one(ie full & half casters). Without getting into specifics, warlocks have too many no prereq invocations that need to be split into low & higher level versions and the dip carries a lot of other goodies

 

[MarkB]

Bladelock Extra Attack and multiple Eldritch Blast beams scaling with warlock levels pretty much eliminates any warlock dip that would want to use these features, they just don't keep up at higher levels.

Bladelock dips could still gain Extra Attack through their primary class, so the question is whether you're getting anything out of it that's worth delaying Extra Attack a level? Then there are rogues - I can't help wondering whether they made Pact of the Blade Cha/Wis to rule out Arcane Trickster builds.

I don't see myself dipping for the Familiar or the Tome.

What about a slightly deeper dip - are there any Invocations you'd dip for from another class?

 

[Pauln6]

It sort of feels that, thematically, paladin smites shouldn't work with pact of the blade. You only gain the new attack stat by invoking the power of some unearthly being while you only get to smite by invoking your devotion to a different being. It kind of feels like they should be either / or but not both.

 

[Sorcerers Apprentice]

Bladelock dips could still gain Extra Attack through their primary class, so the question is whether you're getting anything out of it that's worth delaying Extra Attack a level? Then there are rogues - I can't help wondering whether they made Pact of the Blade Cha/Wis to rule out Arcane Trickster builds.

Ah, you're right, for some reason I thought with pact weapon the only way to get extra attack was through the spell. That makes the ol' pallock viable in 1D&D!

That also enables a new build, the WaRanger! WIS primary, and uses the "returning" feature of the pact weapon to make throwing attacks all the time.

 

[DEFCON 1]

This is my one bummer of the system... the one class that has been the foundational "dip" class is the one with perhaps the greatest narrative background and the least suited story-wise for dipping. Rarely do people dip warlock because they want to play the story of coming upon some patron mid-campaign and incorporate that pact into their adventures... they do it purely for the game mechanics boost. And in that regard, I almost thus wish it was one of the more generic classes-- fighter, rogue-- that was that foundational dip that everyone wanted. There's much less story and background you have to ignore in the class if you multiclass fighter or rogue just for the mechanics.

But that ship sailed a long time ago and I've come to accept it.

 

[MarkB]

This is my one bummer of the system... the one class that has been the foundational "dip" class is the one with perhaps the greatest narrative background and the least suited story-wise for dipping. Rarely do people dip warlock because they want to play the story of coming upon some patron mid-campaign and incorporate that pact into their adventures... they do it purely for the game mechanics boost. And in that regard, I almost thus wish it was one of the more generic classes-- fighter, rogue-- that was that foundational dip that everyone wanted. There's much less story and background you have to ignore in the class if you multiclass fighter or rogue just for the mechanics.

But that ship sailed a long time ago and I've come to accept it.

Well, with the current version some of that narrative does get pushed back. You could take a 1-2 level dip and characterise it simply as having found a way to tap into extraplanar energies, without ever having to trace those energies back to a specific, personified source.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Well, with the current version some of that narrative does get pushed back. You could take a 1-2 level dip and characterise it simply as having found a way to tap into extraplanar energies, without ever having to trace those energies back to a specific, personified source.

That is actually a very good point about the new warlock that I hadn't thought of. Thank you. Doesn't solve, but does ameliorate the issue.