D&D 5E Warlocks and Hex and the "daily morning short rest"

[Krachek]

The duration of the spell *very strongly* implies that the spell can be transferred hours later. Why would the spell last hours otherwise?

The *real* question for me is "is it ok to cast it in the morning and then take a short rest right away to get the spell slot back".

Maintain concentration on a spell is allowed in short rest, as read on Sage Advice.

For the "real" question my answer is no. Unless you want your players to play a gimmick game style.

 

[ccs]

The bag of rats thing is just pure meta-gaming. If you ever done it, don't sugar-coat it and just admit you were doing something as ridiculous as keeping rats in your inventory, and killing them at certain times just to save a spell slot. People like that also intend to gain temp HP from Dark One's Blessing. This one is easier to tell them NO. It clearly states 'hostile' creature, so little creatures are not hostile to you.

I'm sure I could make them hostile 1st....

 

[Ganymede81]

Maintain concentration on a spell is allowed in short rest, as read on Sage Advice.

No, Mike Mearls allows for concentration to be maintained during a short rest in his games.

I stress, "[Jeremy Crawford gives] official #DnD rulings, while other members of the team give advice, as well as insights on tweaking the game."



https://twitter.com/JeremyECrawford/status/704531715239206912?ref_src=twsrc^tfw

 

[cbwjm]

You're going it at it in reverse. The real question isn't "can you concentrate while short resting". It's "can you rest while concentrating". Is concentrating on a spell too mentally taxing so you can't relax and get a rest? THAT is the question.

And I don't think it is. I don't see it as furrowed brow focusing on maintaining the spell, I see it as something that is almost reflex for the caster. It can be disrupted, by damage or being knocked out, and it can be maintained during a short rest. From reading the details of a short rest, I really don't see it as total relaxation, it's more of just taking a quick break, it's fine to concentrate on a spell during one.

 

[Darkness]

Keep it civil: Don't engage in personal attacks, name-calling, or blanket generalizations in your discussions. Say how you feel or what you think, but be careful about ascribing motives to the actions of others or telling others how they "should" think. People seeking to engage and discuss will find themselves asking questions, seeking clarifications, and describing their own opinion. People seeking to "win an argument" sometimes end up taking cheap shots, calling people names, and generally trying to indimidate others. My advice: don't try to win.

[MENTION=284]Caliban[/MENTION], your posting in this thread has gotten way too aggressive. Please make sure you're being civil if you continue posting in the thread. I know rules debates can be annoying - maybe step away from the thread for a bit if it's stressing you.

Everyone else, some posts here are quite hyperbolic. So let's cut down on the drama, please - this is just a game about pretending to be an elf, after all.

-Darkness,
EN World moderator

 

[Uchawi]

The 4e version of a warlock's curse was much easier to use. I am not sure why they went with the spell version, when at-will casting is still present in 5E. The concentration aspect complicates it even more. I guess it is just one of those things that leaves you scratching your head. Probably best to change it and make it an extension of warlock at-will damage.

 

[bedir than]

If you can short rest while Concentrating, why can't you long rest while Concentrating?

 

[Caliban]

If you can short rest while Concentrating, why can't you long rest while Concentrating?

Most DM's won't allow it because the base assumption is that you are going to sleep for at least part of the long rest, and you can't concentrate while you are unconscious. Some DM's don't have a problem with it.

I think think you can skate by on a technicality (once) - while it is generally assumed you sleep on a long rest, it's not actually required. If I'm the DM, be prepared for ad hoc penalties if you try to do it for more than one long rest in a row.

 

[Pathkeeper24601]

Most DM's won't allow it because the base assumption is that you are going to sleep for at least part of the long rest, and you can't concentrate while you are unconscious. Some DM's don't have a problem with it.

I think think you can skate by on a technicality (once) - while it is generally assumed you sleep on a long rest, it's not actually required. If I'm the DM, be prepared for ad hoc penalties if you try to do it for more than one long rest in a row.

Best rule I have seen for this is going 24 hours without 8 hours of sleep (4 hours meditation for elves) causes 1 level of exhaustion that can only be removed by sleeping the requisite number of hours (similar to Eating and Drinking rules). Note that this does not have to be contiguous so it is not broken by guard duty. Usually this causes 10 hour long rest.

Generally, I would also rule that it takes a significant break from resting to allow additional rests, but I am also lenient on how much activity is actually required to reset a long rest (small fight may not, but a dragon attacking in the night will).

 

[Flamestrike]

While I'm on board with your dislike of metagaming, I fundamentally disagree that 'taking a short rest straight after a long rest' is metagaming.

If I sit on my couch and watch TV for 6 hours, while recovering from being mugged, then after one hour of rest I'll ask the very reasonable question of, "Have I done anything strenuous this last hour?" If the answer is 'no' then I've just had a short rest and can spend hit dice. One hour after that, I ask again, "Have I done anything strenuous this last hour?" If not, then I've just had a short rest.

Although 2-3 short rests per adventuring day may by typical, it is neither a rule of the game nor a fundamental law of the game world. Your entire waking day may be rest after rest. If magic works such that you regenerate your casting power after one hour's rest, then that idle noble warlock could short rest, cast two spells in 12 seconds or so, short rest, cast 2 more spell, and so on, until he gets his well-deserved long rest after an arduous day of spellcasting.

Why? Because that's how Pact Magic works! That's how Ki points and Sorcery points and Superiority dice etc. all work. Pretending that they don't work that way just because you think it is somehow 'unfair' is your own bias.

Of course the events in the game world may conspire to make an hour's rest impossible, whether for any particular hour or for a whole day (the other side of the short rest mechanic), but ask yourself this: would those bears have attacked the party at breakfast if there were no short rest based PCs? Will the very existence of short rest PCs mean that the universe spontaneously creates PC-bothering bears at 59 minute intervals?

We've had a long rest, and get the benefits. At breakfast the ranger comes back with a brace of live rabbits that he trapped; he kills one, I kill the other, the halfling cooks them because stereotype. I also cast armour of agathys so, along with the hex I cast on my rabbit I have used both Pact Magic slots. The ranger, of course, had cast hunter's mark on the rabbit he killed.

One hour after I cast my last spell, I ask if we did anything strenuous in the last hour. If 'no', we have just rested for an hour; a 'short rest'! We get the benefits, which for me means I regain my Pact Magic slots. Why? Because that is exactly how Pact Magic works!

Is this 'metagaming'? No! It's how the world works! 'Resting' has benefits. If you have exerted yourself by using your spell slots, the way you get them back is by resting. This is not 'metagaming'! Random bears should not miraculously appear in order to punish some PCs for getting their breath back!!

Its not how the world works. The rules of the game of DnD are not a reflection of the objective reality of some alternate universe. Plus; 'DM'. You can spend all day 'short resting' as much as you want, but you dont get back squat unless the DM says so.

'Resting' is how Dungeons and Dragons handles resource replenishment. Dungeons and Dragons is a game. A game based around resource management (at its core). Hit points, Hit dice, gold pieces, XP, spell slots, charges, dailies, 1/short rest etc are all resources that need to be managed.

Come into my game and try and game the rest mechanic (or any other mechanic), and you'll find it doesnt work.

To answer the OPs question, you dont need a list of bolted on rules to stop players from gaming the rest mechanic (or any other mechanic). Just the common sense application of two little letters: Say 'No'.

If the player wants to sook about it; he knows where the door is.