Whirtlestaff's Wizards' Academy Revisited, OOC01
- Thread starter Leif
- Start date
Scotley
Hero
I think you are placing too much value on the elf abilities. Of course I am biased. 
How much better a warrior do they really make a character? You talk of 5 feats worth of weapons, but I'm only using two. How many character will actually use both a longbow and a shortbow in composite and regular versions? Or two different swords for that matter. The advantage of a long sword over a dagger is only the difference between a d4 and a d8 it is only slightly better than the quarterstaff's d6. The rapier only does a d6, though it is more likely to get a crit. I would counter that the loss of two points of str., which means I'm less likely to hit and will do one less point of damage balances that out. I will still be limited to the wizard's base attack bonus. That limited base attack bonus also waters down any advantage in crit ranges for the elf weapons. With the lack of armor and crappy hit points I rolled, I really think Tylara's sword will be more for show than use.
Compared to a human the elf gets one less feat. I submit that the handful of martial weapons is at best marginally better than one feat in the end. A human could use that one feat to take simple weapons and get javelins, crossbows, spears, and the morning star as well as others. I submit that the weapons I took don't represent a significant advantage over that select.
Let's talk skill bonuses. A third level human gets 6 skill points extra. The elf gets +2 on three skills or 6 points extra. And without the flexibility to put them on skills of my choice. The other elf abilities are largely balanced out over time as the human continues to get extra skill points at every level and has more flexible multi-class options.
If I multi-class into pretty much any other core class, but sorcerer at any time during Tylara's career she will get extra weapon proficiencies largely making the additional weapons moot.
Anyway, is the elf good? Yes. Are the elf's abilities somewhat front loaded compared to a human? Yes, but by third level, where we started, the human has largely caught up. Is the Elf way better than a human or dwarf? I don't think so. I choose the elf mainly to differentiate her from the other characters in the party, who all have the same class. Did you really want to DM for 8 bearded pointy hat wearing male humans? By the time I got around to suggesting her we already had people pimping their humans, dwarf and Gnome. Given the short list of races, which you gave us, I don't think I have taken any unfair advantage. The only other race on the list was the half-elf, which by the way is widely regarded as the weakest of the Player's handbook Races. Dwarf is generally regarded as the strongest rather than the Elf.
Lest we forget you actually suggested that I make Tylara a Grey Elf as opposed to a regular elf. But pretty much everything that seems to be in contention would be true of the regular as well as gray elf.
Anyway, you asked for comments and observations, so there are mine.
Scott
How much better a warrior do they really make a character? You talk of 5 feats worth of weapons, but I'm only using two. How many character will actually use both a longbow and a shortbow in composite and regular versions? Or two different swords for that matter. The advantage of a long sword over a dagger is only the difference between a d4 and a d8 it is only slightly better than the quarterstaff's d6. The rapier only does a d6, though it is more likely to get a crit. I would counter that the loss of two points of str., which means I'm less likely to hit and will do one less point of damage balances that out. I will still be limited to the wizard's base attack bonus. That limited base attack bonus also waters down any advantage in crit ranges for the elf weapons. With the lack of armor and crappy hit points I rolled, I really think Tylara's sword will be more for show than use.
Compared to a human the elf gets one less feat. I submit that the handful of martial weapons is at best marginally better than one feat in the end. A human could use that one feat to take simple weapons and get javelins, crossbows, spears, and the morning star as well as others. I submit that the weapons I took don't represent a significant advantage over that select.
Let's talk skill bonuses. A third level human gets 6 skill points extra. The elf gets +2 on three skills or 6 points extra. And without the flexibility to put them on skills of my choice. The other elf abilities are largely balanced out over time as the human continues to get extra skill points at every level and has more flexible multi-class options.
If I multi-class into pretty much any other core class, but sorcerer at any time during Tylara's career she will get extra weapon proficiencies largely making the additional weapons moot.
Anyway, is the elf good? Yes. Are the elf's abilities somewhat front loaded compared to a human? Yes, but by third level, where we started, the human has largely caught up. Is the Elf way better than a human or dwarf? I don't think so. I choose the elf mainly to differentiate her from the other characters in the party, who all have the same class. Did you really want to DM for 8 bearded pointy hat wearing male humans? By the time I got around to suggesting her we already had people pimping their humans, dwarf and Gnome. Given the short list of races, which you gave us, I don't think I have taken any unfair advantage. The only other race on the list was the half-elf, which by the way is widely regarded as the weakest of the Player's handbook Races. Dwarf is generally regarded as the strongest rather than the Elf.
Lest we forget you actually suggested that I make Tylara a Grey Elf as opposed to a regular elf. But pretty much everything that seems to be in contention would be true of the regular as well as gray elf.
Anyway, you asked for comments and observations, so there are mine.
Scott
Zurai
First Post
I'm sorry to say, but I'm going to withdraw from this game.
Reason for withdrawing: I just don't like the choices the DM is making in dealing with the characters OOC. I won't enumerate them here because I don't want to start an argument; just suffice to say that I find myself shaking my head in real life way too much to be able to stay in character. Sorry again.
Reason for withdrawing: I just don't like the choices the DM is making in dealing with the characters OOC. I won't enumerate them here because I don't want to start an argument; just suffice to say that I find myself shaking my head in real life way too much to be able to stay in character. Sorry again.
Scotley
Hero
Leif said:WTF EVER, dude! Remind me to never ask for your comments again.
Fair enough, but you did ask, so I gave them. It was not my intention to place any blame, but to make it clear that throughout the character creation process I have adhered to the guidelines you set. Anyway, I am happy with my character and eager to continue the game.
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