variant Multiclass

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

This is one someone pointed out to me in my own multiclass variant.

Take the fighter and give him the rogue's riposte strike. Now I hit you and your marked. Attack someone else, and I get a free attack. Attack me, and I get a free attack.

One Dex vs. AC (Dex won't be maxed out for a Fighter) for 1[W] + Dex damage to get a Str vs. AC attack for 1[W] + Str damage if the target attacks you before the start of your next turn or attacks someone else before the end of your next turn doesn't strike me as particularly overpowering.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Also, I agree with others that the fighter's permanent +1 is too strong. That's a gimme for any fighter type.

Problem is that combat challenge (stop movement on OA) or OA against shifting are far too strong.

Add Wis bonus to OA 'to hit' might work, but I don't really feel that a permanent +1 is too strong - for many fighter types the 'opportunity cost' of losing one of their own precious at-wills is pretty high too.

 

[Stalker0]

Add Wis bonus to OA 'to hit' might work, but I don't really feel that a permanent +1 is too strong - for many fighter types the 'opportunity cost' of losing one of their own precious at-wills is pretty high too.

I don't feel there is really any oppurtunity cost at all, 3 of the fighter at-wills are great.

Why not just give them the fighters marking ability without any of the extra that goes with it?

 

[Stalker0]

One Dex vs. AC (Dex won't be maxed out for a Fighter) for 1[W] + Dex damage to get a Str vs. AC attack for 1[W] + Str damage if the target attacks you before the start of your next turn or attacks someone else before the end of your next turn doesn't strike me as particularly overpowering.

Considering the fighter is multiclassing with rogue its likely his dex will be pretty high. If he's a light blade fighter, dex is very useful for him, and will probably be his second highest stat.

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

Considering the fighter is multiclassing with rogue its likely his dex will be pretty high. If he's a light blade fighter, dex is very useful for him, and will probably be his second highest stat.

True, but I meant sub-optimal in the sense that Dex wouldn't be as high as Str, meaning that the other Fighter at-wills, which are Str-based, have better odds of hitting and do slightly higher damage.

Basically, I think that a Fighter multiclassing to Rogue to get Riposte Strike so he can trade one of his Fighter at-wills for an at-will which is poorer to hit-wise and damage-wise, but provides a guaranteed second (basic melee) attack (not guaranteed damage) isn't an overpowered combo.

 

[Crashy75]

A couple technical points -

1) I'd specify Hunter's Mark lasts until the end of your next turn, as per the errata.

2) I'd specify that the warlock gets the at-will that matches his pact. Also, this might best be limited to "till the end of your next turn" like HQ.

I agree with Larry, though, that swapping at-wills might be too much. What I think might be better is the "choose an at-will as an encounter" like the Wizard is RAW. I think it's great you can multi and get a wizard power, but why can't you multi and use Tide of Iron once a fight (per RAW)? Your total swap goes a bit too far, I think, but as an encounter I think it works very well.

I like the addition of more class features and requiring a skill be trained as a pre-req.

I also agree. At one time I was very gung ho for free-form multiclass, but I have since changed my opinion after seeing a few crazy builds. I think an at-will as an encounter is a nice compromise.

 

[Crashy75]

Problem is that combat challenge (stop movement on OA) or OA against shifting are far too strong.

Add Wis bonus to OA 'to hit' might work, but I don't really feel that a permanent +1 is too strong - for many fighter types the 'opportunity cost' of losing one of their own precious at-wills is pretty high too.

Why not just give combat superiority once per encounter? That's still pretty good, but not overly so (wis bonus to a single oa, and stop the opponent).

 

[keterys]

Why not just give the same bonus for fighter as it gets now? That is, one attack at +1 with combat challenge per encounter?

Anyhow, I don't think the at-will swapping is bad, unlike the rest... but I think you should consider a non-multiclass option of a similar power level. Like if you can get an extra at-will power if you remove the ability to multiclass, that makes it a very different equation.