Special Conversion Thread: Moldvay's Undead

[Shade]

Anyone else notice how they wanted to make superzombies but just added HD and anti-abilities? It would be much cooler just to have a few HD and have them be tough. Oh well.

I think they were trying to simulate the "falls apart, but keeps on attacking" schtick. You know, the ol' one-armed torso still crawling after the protaganist cliche in horror and sci-fi flicks?

Back to the task at hand. I could go with 1/3 or 2/3 hp. As an alternative, each hit could add a penalty with a certain % chance. It's more "swingy" and less "grindy" but might be easier. Maybe 30% of hits?

That might make 'em too tough, though. This is one of those unfortunate monster concepts that doesn't really fit well within the ruleset.

Another options just came to mind: multiple stat blocks. We could start with the 6 HD "super zombie" with two slams and a bite attack, then after it is "destroyed", switch to the "damaged" stat block, which has lesser HD, Str, and maybe loses a slam attack. Finally, we'd have the "heavily damaged" zombie, with only a bite left and only half its movement rate. It's a bit more work for us, but would make things easier on DMs.

 

[freyar]

I'm happy with the -2 penalties to, say, attack and damage. I'm just not sure how to trigger that. Let's say at 2/3 and 1/3 hp, I guess, like Cleon suggests.

 

[Shade]

If they are taking two -2 penalties to attack or damage rolls, I'd recommend we start them with Str 8 higher than a standard zombie to offset the penalties, and thus make them the equivalent of a standard zombie at the worst incarnation.

 

[Cleon]

Another options just came to mind: multiple stat blocks. We could start with the 6 HD "super zombie" with two slams and a bite attack, then after it is "destroyed", switch to the "damaged" stat block, which has lesser HD, Str, and maybe loses a slam attack. Finally, we'd have the "heavily damaged" zombie, with only a bite left and only half its movement rate. It's a bit more work for us, but would make things easier on DMs.

Well there are all kinds of options - multiple stat-blocks, losing attacks or combat penalties if it takes a critical, et cetera - but I feel we'd better keep them simple. Are we agreed on 1/3 and 2/3 hit points as the best compromise?

Deterioration: If a walking dead is reduced to 2/3 of its original hit points (26 hp for a standard walking dead), it takes a -2 penalty to its attack and damage rolls. This penalty increases to -4 if it falls to 1/3 its original hit points (13 hp for a standard walking dead).

If they are taking two -2 penalties to attack or damage rolls, I'd recommend we start them with Str 8 higher than a standard zombie to offset the penalties, and thus make them the equivalent of a standard zombie at the worst incarnation.

Strength 20? I'd have no objection to that.

 

[demiurge1138]

I like Shade's multiple stat block idea, actually.

 

[freyar]

What exactly does the multiple stat block get us? I think we've already decided not to destroy it and have it come back, so don't we just want to layer penalties?

 

[Shade]

The more I think about it, the more I like the multiple stat block approach as well.

I like the visual of beating the thing down, then it gets back up, albeit weaker from damage. This is an iconic image in horror movies.

Secondly, it makes it much easier for the DM to adjudicate. Once it reaches 0 hp or less, just switch to the next stat block and move on. It also allows for removing some of the attacks (rather than just making them less likely to hit), to allow for limb loss, etc.

There's precedent for this, in a way, with the deadborn vulture in MMV.

 

[freyar]

Ok, that's fine with me. But then let's start them with fewer HD, because this is an effective HD boost. Maybe 3HD for the first version, 2HD for the second, 1 for the third. That totals the original 6 even.

 

[Shade]

Fair enough!

 

[Cleon]

Ok, that's fine with me. But then let's start them with fewer HD, because this is an effective HD boost. Maybe 3HD for the first version, 2HD for the second, 1 for the third. That totals the original 6 even.

Well it's not the way I'd have gone, but I'm game.

I'd rather have it have more Hit Dice than that though, say 4HD/3HD/2HD.

Something like:

Full Strength - 4HD, speed 30 ft, Strength 18, 2 1d6+4 slams and 1d4+2 bite.
Half-Dead - 3HD, speed 30 ft, Strength 16, 1d6+3 slam and 1d4+1 bite.
Quarter-Dead - 2HD, speed 30 ft. (cannot Run), Strength 14, 1d6+3 slam.