Why I Dislike the term Railroading

[Doug McCrae]

If by plotted adventure one means a linear adventure where scene A leads to scene B leads to scene C etc, again that can be achieved without railroading much of the time. Not all of the time, but most of the time, simply by ensuring that scene B is somewhere the players will most likely want to go.

After all the question is not, "Are plotted adventures never railroads?" Ofc not, they sometimes are. The question is, "Can you have a plotted adventure that isn't a railroad?" The answer to that is, definitely, yes.

 

[ExploderWizard]

If by plotted adventure one means a linear adventure where scene A leads to scene B leads to scene C etc, again that can be achieved without railroading much of the time. Not all of the time, but most of the time, simply by ensuring that scene B is somewhere the players will most likely want to go.

After all the question is not, "Are plotted adventures never railroads?" Ofc not, they sometimes are. The question is, "Can you have a plotted adventure that isn't a railroad?" The answer to that is, definitely, yes.

Which takes us back to defining a plotted adventure. My definition was useless to you. Can you provide a working alternative?

 

[Doug McCrae]

Acid test:

Who's plot was the whole cursed sword business?

If we can't point the finger to any agency within the gameworld we have choo-choo ville.

It's the GM's plan. But do you really think that if the GM has a plan, and it pans out as he wants, that that *must* be a railroad? What if the players were happy with events turning out that way?

Now, otoh, it might be a railroad.

1) GM wants players to go from A to B. Players do everything in their power to avoid B. GM sends falling rocks and orc armies and flooded rivers and the like, so that the PCs can go nowhere but B. That's a railroad. And a plot.

2) GM wants players to go from A to B. Players are happy to go to B. That's not a railroad. And a plot.

 

[Doug McCrae]

Which takes us back to defining a plotted adventure. My definition was useless to you. Can you provide a working alternative?

There are a variety of possible meanings but I'm pretty sure no one uses 'plotted adventure' to mean that there are NPCs in the adventure that have plots. That really is useless because a) it's not what anyone means imo, and b) it applies to pretty much every adventure ever published.

Other possibilities:
1) A linear adventure. Scene A leads to B leads to C.
2) A non-linear, but still strongly structured adventure. Scene A leads to B, can lead to C or D.
3) An adventure in which there is a sequence of events the GM wants to see occur.
4) An adventure in which there is a sequence of events which must occur.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

I could buy that.

So if "the illusion of choice" is every DM's tool, then railroading is when all your players successfully disbelieve.

Cheers, -- N

Or the DM has failed his spellcrafting roll.

There may be a bit more to it than that - some DM's just don't have the ranks in Profession [Dungeon Master] to pull it off, and a lot of folks who might be able to pull it off try not to do it in the first place.

The best way of giving the illusion of choice is by actually giving the players a choice, and being prepared to change your plans on the fly. Just be ready for the most likely paths the PCs might take, and sometimes, if you weren't ready... neither was the bad guy. (Or the PCs have tried something truly boneheaded, like trying to swim the Rhine, in flood, without having any ranks in the skill*....)

The Auld Grump

* Almost a near TPK, and the only PC who didn't make the attempt was also the only one who had any ranks in Swim... he decided to look around to find a boat that he could steal. And found one. I was prepared for the PCs trying to cross the river, just not the PCs drowning themselves instead of looking for a boat.... He was able to rescue the others before they were too drowned.

 

[Doug McCrae]

GM sends falling rocks and orc armies and flooded rivers

the Rhine, in flood

Railroad!

 

[Obryn]

A linear adventure is not the same thing as a railroad. Linear just implies a sequence of events - not that the players have no choice or agency.

The outcome isn't pre-determined, either.

I think it would be more helpful to consider railroading as something a DM does - not a characteristic of a given adventure or module. I think that's where everything goes awry.

-O

 

[Ariosto]

If the players are not unwilling to go with the plot, they're not being railroaded.

Wrong. That is analogous to pretending that a regime would suddenly lose the character of 'dictatorship' were it successful in ending dissent.

I have never seen this 'out' proposed by opponents of 'railroading'. It is the ability to identify the behavior in its own right that makes the category useful. By avoiding the behavior in the first place, one obviates resentment of it.

 

[Doug McCrae]

I think it would be more helpful to consider railroading as something a DM does - not a characteristic of a given adventure or module.

Sometimes it's there in the text. For example in Whispers of the Vampire's Blade there is a scene near the start in which the PCs pursue the BBEG who is escaping by coach, but they *cannot* catch him because if they do the rest of the module doesn't work.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Railroad!

Not my fault man! It was springtime (without Hitler) in the Germanies.

They could have found the boat (actually two boats - one in bad shape, one in decent condition, but hidden), walked upstream to the town (yes, they were swimming downstream from a town, in the river... into which the chamber pots were emptied on a regular basis...). They could have walked downstream to a ferry, or further down to a bridge. But noooo, they had to try swimming across, without the damned skill!

No, I am not still mystified by that, almost ten years later. Why do you ask?

Ah well, not as bad as the wizard in OD&D who had himself launched over a castle wall via catapult. Well... more into a castle wall, rather than over....


I suppose trying to suppress the Lemming reflex can count as railroading.... (No! You can't have your characters die here! Go die over there like you're supposed to!)

The Auld Grump