No Character Builder Update

[djordi]

EXPLETIVE happens. Coming from the other end of software development I know that.

The issue is enough delays have happened with DDI that it's pretty clear that there are core issues with the production and pipeline. When the Monster Manual 3 was published it took three months before the new format appeared in DDI. Now, granted, that was a large task of converting every monster in the game. But they definitely knew it was going to happen when the book was complete and sent for proofing. They most likely knew well before then during the production of the book.

It seems like the same issues are apparent with Dark Sun and Essentials. WoTC knew that there were some major changes required well before the books were printed, but someone messed up.

I was pleasantly surprised when WoTC first announced that DDI would update with the official release of the Essentials books. "Oh, they're getting their act together to make a good impression on the new customers they're trying to bring in and some people who have lapsed."

And we now see how that turned out.

As a DDI consumer my expectation is that Dragon and Dungeon content is in at the beginning of the next month. Not any of this "months later" stuff that's been happening. The same with the books. Everything USED to get updated like that.

 

[CovertOps]

EXPLETIVE happens. Coming from the other end of software development I know that.

The issue is enough delays have happened with DDI that it's pretty clear that there are core issues with the production and pipeline. When the Monster Manual 3 was published it took three months before the new format appeared in DDI. Now, granted, that was a large task of converting every monster in the game. But they definitely knew it was going to happen when the book was complete and sent for proofing. They most likely knew well before then during the production of the book.

It seems like the same issues are apparent with Dark Sun and Essentials. WoTC knew that there were some major changes required well before the books were printed, but someone messed up.

I was pleasantly surprised when WoTC first announced that DDI would update with the official release of the Essentials books. "Oh, they're getting their act together to make a good impression on the new customers they're trying to bring in and some people who have lapsed."

And we now see how that turned out.

As a DDI consumer my expectation is that Dragon and Dungeon content is in at the beginning of the next month. Not any of this "months later" stuff that's been happening. The same with the books. Everything USED to get updated like that.

Updates seem to come out on time if all they have to do is update the DB. My guess is they need 1 extra body doing the programming. You branch your code so you can do data updates in one branch and code updates in the other side by side. I'll also guess that they can't justify the cost for that 1 person to upper management for some dumb reason.

 

[the Jester]

If WotC could guarantee an on-time update to the Compendium, CB and ATs every month, would you be willing to pay twice the current rate?

Increasing their workload costs money. You pay for the tools and the online content in Dungeon and Dragon, and the updates are a part of the package, but I think it is completely ridiculous to whine and cry that missing an update twice a year means that WotC has ruined your game, shot your dog and stolen your lunch.

 

[djordi]

If WotC could guarantee an on-time update to the Compendium, CB and ATs every month, would you be willing to pay twice the current rate?

Increasing their workload costs money. You pay for the tools and the online content in Dungeon and Dragon, and the updates are a part of the package, but I think it is completely ridiculous to whine and cry that missing an update twice a year means that WotC has ruined your game, shot your dog and stolen your lunch.

Asteroids do not concern me.











Ok, serious answer now

I believe it is a mischaracterization to call presenting expectations along with observations that there are serious production and pipeline issues with DDI as "whining and crying."

My life is not going to end because I can't build Dark Sun characters in CB. In fact at the moment it will be hardly affected at all since my group is currently on hiatus from playing. I'm preparing a new campaign and it'll be a bit before I can play. But when we playing before it grew to be a pain to wait for late, late updates.

"Hey Jim, these duelist feats would be perfect for your rogue!"

"Awesome, I'll tweak my dude in the next update."

*next update arrives*

"Oh I guess it'll be next month."

*next update arrives*

"Oh... next month?"​

I just see this as signs of bigger issues. In general when one deliverable is 20% late or behind schedule most people really want to believe that it's a one time occurrence and they'll catch up. When in reality it's usually that they'll always be 20% late.

Also, I would totes pay 2x the current rate if it would guaranteed real on time updates. Well, as long as it included progress with more Adventure Tools. But that's not the issue here. The issue is DDI is failing to meet their dates. When it's less than a week out for an already delayed update and they say "maybe next month?" that points to bigger issues. At the very least it points to bad production practices / scheduling. And it probably points to a pipeline that makes it difficult to actually do the updates.

 

[Markn]

Fact - WotC employees work on books about a year in advance.
Fact - There are some design changes that happen after most of the book is complete, but not by much. Major additions/changes that are needed for CB or MB should be recognized long before the "data due date" comes up.
Fact - Once a book goes to the printers, its set in stone. If I'm not mistaken this is about 2-3 months in advance.

WotC should be working with that schedule. In other words, they should be working on data input/CB & MB redesigns about 2 months in advance. Therefore, if they fail to meet their own personal deadline of 2 months prior to release, they should still have 2 months to resolve any issues and still publish the content on time. This is my opinion, but would make for a much more successful model than they currently have.

Now for some speculation. I suspect that WorC is focusing on some new major releases which is taking a majority of their time - and possibly has been for a while now. Near Gencon we heard that they are getting close to making some big announcements. I suspect it might be a completely new version of both the CB and the MB (which may include some extra tools). Its possible that I am wrong but this is my gut feeling at the moment. Its possible that the new software is taking longer than expected OR they have some bugs that need to be worked out, and therefore are behind the 8-ball on support of this version since they were anticipating the release of the other one by now.

Anyways, carry on with your day. This is my .02 gp.

 

[drothgery]

Also, I would totes pay 2x the current rate if it would guaranteed real on time updates. Well, as long as it included progress with more Adventure Tools. But that's not the issue here. The issue is DDI is failing to meet their dates. When it's less than a week out for an already delayed update and they say "maybe next month?" that points to bigger issues. At the very least it points to bad production practices / scheduling. And it probably points to a pipeline that makes it difficult to actually do the updates.

The update was going to be late, but it was also going to include material that would normally not appear until next month's update. Like I said before, this has all the signs of the D&Di team realizing they were going to be late with the Dark Sun + other August releases updates, and then promising to get them AND the Essentials updates done a couple of weeks early as a way of compensating. Which I've seen IT managers try to do more times than I can count (it never works, but that doesn't stop people from trying; it's almost as much of a classic as trying to add more people to a late project and then being shocked that it makes the project later). What they should have done is slipped the Dark Sun/August updates AND slipped all future updates until they have a data-only update month by the same amount of time (starting with the September/Essentials updates).

 

[Truename]

Updates seem to come out on time if all they have to do is update the DB. My guess is they need 1 extra body doing the programming. You branch your code so you can do data updates in one branch and code updates in the other side by side. I'll also guess that they can't justify the cost for that 1 person to upper management for some dumb reason.

Sorry to pick on you, CovertOps, but this armchair quarterbacking is driving me crazy. (It's not just you; your post just happened to be handy.) As a professional programmer and consultant specializing in team software development processes, I can tell you it's just not that simple.

YES, WotC should be able to meet their commitments. YES, there are certainly problems with the way they're approaching their software planning. NO, these problems are not unique to WoTC. NO, it's not a sign of management incompetence or miserliness. Without knowing exactly what's happening on the DDI team, there is no way to know what the problem is. The only thing that's certain is that the simplistic amateur-hour "solutions" on this thread won't fix it.

Software development is hard. Really, really hard. Unless you're very careful about taking time for code quality, the same tasks become harder and slower over time. Unless you're very careful about risk management, your software has less than a 10% chance of meeting its deadlines. And once a team gets to a certain size, adding more people slows development down even further.

Software development is hard. Let's go shopping!

 

[caudor]

[Gets a cig and inhales]

No matter how hard I try, I just can't seem to get worked up over it. It takes more than an overdue game update to get me worked up. Don't know if that's a blessing or a curse.

Sorry, that's just me.

 

[Aegeri]

I spend a lot of time defending Wizards on other forums and here. It's getting harder and harder to do so when they continually pull things like this, delaying the PE: Assassin article (one of the only things I was genuinely looking forward to this month) and such forth. I mean, I wanted to start my games after Psionic Power and Essentials was out, so my PCs didn't have to do a lot of rebuilding their characters and such. Now, to be fair to them, I have to allow them to rebuild their characters after the initial couple of sessions (changing macros in my online games to match things they fiddled with). That wastes a lot of time in my online games (as invariably it is done at the beginning of a session) so that means less DnD for Aegeri. That doesn't make me happy at all.

So now I delay my games start further or I play with characters that won't be the same in two weeks or so time. That's my problem.

 

[Holy Bovine]

... to whine and cry that missing an update twice a year means that WotC has ruined your game, shot your dog and stolen your lunch.

Well if people could say that and mean it about 4E itself being released on this very board I see no reason why they can't say it about a missed update...

/sarcasm off


OK seriously the missed update is disappointing as I was really looking forward to the Dark Sun stuff. Is it fraud? Of course not. What nonsense.

I would definitely recommend everyone who has a DDI account to email/write WotC customer service to find out what compensation, if any, subscribers can expect. It is still a missed update and deserving of some kind of recognition of the inconvenience of it. Even if they offer nothing if they get a couple of thousand complaints it will hopefully send the message that we, as consumers, are watching and expecting to get the service we all pay for with the unspoken agreement that they may lose 1000s of paying customers if they fail to meet deadlines on a regular basis (and twice in the 18 months or so CB & AT have been around is not regular).