So Legends and Lore was just Mearls ruminating?

[Gundark]

Yes. (need to spread XP...)

But, if you are looking for evidence of a new edition coming, look at the anounced products, especially over the last 6 months. Its the sort of schedule you would have if you were trying to just keep the current edition afloat while planning a new one.

Must spread xp...

Yeah. After reading today's L&L article I suspect he's opening up the discussion around what the next version of D&D will look like (4.5 or 5e).

 

[technoextreme]

Yes. (need to spread XP...)

But, if you are looking for evidence of a new edition coming, look at the anounced products, especially over the last 6 months. Its the sort of schedule you would have if you were trying to just keep the current edition afloat while planning a new one.

You mean the fact that its now at a reasonable pace that consumers can keep up with?

 

[Pilgrim]

I have a hard time believing that Mearls is simply talking for the sake of doing so. It just doesn't jive with what he's been going on about for some time now.

Honestly, if I were in his place and had a game/edition/product that was doing really well, why take all my time and energy away from editorials for said game and place them into a think tank for something that could be used later down the line.

It just seems like too much of a waste, unless the ideas and feedback are going to be put to use in something else, something new or at the very least, something reworked.

 

[SpydersWebbing]

Must spread xp...

Yeah. After reading today's L&L article I suspect he's opening up the discussion around what the next version of D&D will look like (4.5 or 5e).

Why would they do a new edition? The quality of their products have actually gone up in the last few months. They have asked more questions about how to improve their product than they have in my recent memory, 3rd or 4th edition. That's not the sign of someone trying to cut ties and run. That's the sign of someone trying to make it work.

Now does this mean that they're not planning 5th edition? If those folks are half as creative as I think they are how could they not be planning the next edition, if only for kicks and giggles?

I mean, think about it, what if this guy's writing those articles for fun? I design game systems for fun, why wouldn't he?

 

[Mercurius]

Deja vu.

Anyhow, why does it have to be either/or? Either Mearls is "just ruminating" or he's fishing for 5E feedback? Why can't it be both? Of course then it wouldn't be "just" ruminating for rumination's sake, it would be fishing...but even so, I don't think it is assuming an evil plot to think that Mearls is covertly getting feedback on ideas that he and other designers at WotC have been throwing around with regards to "5E" or whatever the next iteration of the game will be called.

I can guarantee, with 100% certainty, that *every* designer at WotC (as well as numerous freelancers) have a file somewhere (either physical or mental) on how they think that 5E should be designed. I can also guarantee that they are all, with every new idea or concept that is introduced, not just in D&D but in RPGs in general, keeping a mental tally of "keep it, keep it, toss it, keep it, toss it".

As for the "great revelation" of Mearls' columns. If people would have actually read hthe intro to his columns, and actually taken him at his word as opposed to trying to read some giant conspiracy theory into them, they would have been much less stressed.

Read my above paragraph. It isn't some "giant conspiracy theory" to think that Mearls is opening the door a bit and sharing some of this thoughts about, as his intro says, where D&D might be going. But I do think that the intro doesn't quite match up with what he's actually doing; his articles, for instance, aren't just so that he can get a better understanding of the game. He can save that sort of thing for the blogosphere. While writing for Legends & Lore he effectively is the voice of WotC D&D and everything he writes means something, or says something about the game in an official way.

One of the burdens of being a public figure is that everything you say is taken apart and interpreted. Mearls could get away with "just ruminating" on Blogger, but on the official website? Seems a tad disingenuous if that's what he's claiming.

All that said, I think it is a great idea to make "pre-5E ruminations" open to the community. I personally still think that we're going to see "5E" (by whatever name) sometime in 2013 or 2014, but that we might see some kind of alpha version in 2012 in the form of DDI playtesting of various rules, maybe a "rule of the month" for members to try out. Then you might have a beta segment in 2013 and a full-blown new edition in 2014 to line up with the 40th anniversary. Just imagine the sort of energy this would build in the community - a couple years of playtesting and working on the next iteration of the game together, as a community. With his ideas of "complexity dials" and such this could actually work, because with a simple core game just about any variation could be legit.

An alternate perspective is that they come out with a "complexity dial" supplement in 2012 or 2013 that is effectively a playtest for 5E in 2014 or 2015, not unlike some of the later 3.5 products previewed 4E to some extent.

@drothgery - slight nitpick. 4e was announced at Gencon 07 and released Gencon 08

I think someone corrected this, but to nitpick your nitpick, 4E was announced at Gencon '07 and released in early June of '08.

You mean the fact that its now at a reasonable pace that consumers can keep up with?

You mean for the first time in, what, 15 years? When was the last time the product release was this sparse? Never in 4E or 3.x, as far as I can remember. Maybe in the latter days of 2E? I can't remember. But even in a slower economy I can't see this being the pace that WotC wants to maintain over the long haul. I mean, the slower production could be more indicative of their focus on DDI, but even so I would think they want to release more than a single major supplement once a month or so. Why not do both - emphasize DDI and produce a solid quantity of quality products? Maybe not 5-6 products every month, but certainly 2-3 is workable.

My personal preference would be to see about three products a month: one rules expansion of some kind, whether a splat, a setting or theme book; one adventure; and one gimmicky product like dungeon tiles or cards of some kind. Then, maybe once a quarter, a nice huge box set - maybe a mega-adventure or a complete campaign setting.

 

[SpydersWebbing]

You mean for the first time in, what, 15 years? When was the last time the product release was this sparse? Never in 4E or 3.x, as far as I can remember. Maybe in the latter days of 2E? I can't remember. But even in a slower economy I can't see this being the pace that WotC wants to maintain over the long haul. I mean, the slower production could be more indicative of their focus on DDI, but even so I would think they want to release more than a single major supplement once a month or so. Why not do both - emphasize DDI and produce a solid quantity of quality products? Maybe not 5-6 products every month, but certainly 2-3 is workable.

My personal preference would be to see about three products a month: one rules expansion of some kind, whether a splat, a setting or theme book; one adventure; and one gimmicky product like dungeon tiles or cards of some kind. Then, maybe once a quarter, a nice huge box set - maybe a mega-adventure or a complete campaign setting.

Not that I could do something more competent than ride my bike during the time of 2nd edition, but isn't that a bit of an overstatement? From what I heard 2nd Edition was a deadland in the latter years. TSR had effectively abandoned DnD.

And to be honest with the quality of the of stuff that's come out this year I like the fact that it's a bit less. I never liked the glut of stuff coming out for 3rd edition, regardless of whether it was 3.0 or 3.5. I mean, honestly, how much of that stuff was actually used? The only things I remember using at all were the Monster Manuals, and that's because I was a DM and didn't want to design my own monsters! The Shadowfell set? I'll use that in some fashion probably until I die (or the next edition, whichever comes first. I'm hoping for the next edition to be first). Primal Power? Not as much.

That and the serious lack of cash these days means that whatever they make needs to be-dare I say it- essential, so making more things isn't as important as making a necessary product. My guess is that the DnD Tiles make them far more money than their books ever will, if only because they get used far more often than the books do themselves.

That being said, everything I've said is conjecture, and should probably be treated as such.

 

[Pentius]

I have a hard time believing that Mearls is simply talking for the sake of doing so. It just doesn't jive with what he's been going on about for some time now.

Honestly, if I were in his place and had a game/edition/product that was doing really well, why take all my time and energy away from editorials for said game and place them into a think tank for something that could be used later down the line.

It just seems like too much of a waste, unless the ideas and feedback are going to be put to use in something else, something new or at the very least, something reworked.

I think that, as a high-ranking employee of a company that taken some heat from fans lately for not communicating enough with the fanbase, maintaining a blog like L&L is a worthwhile undertaking, even if the ruminations have nothing to do with anything beyond being ruminations.

 

[SpydersWebbing]

You mean for the first time in, what, 15 years? When was the last time the product release was this sparse? Never in 4E or 3.x, as far as I can remember. Maybe in the latter days of 2E? I can't remember. But even in a slower economy I can't see this being the pace that WotC wants to maintain over the long haul. I mean, the slower production could be more indicative of their focus on DDI, but even so I would think they want to release more than a single major supplement once a month or so. Why not do both - emphasize DDI and produce a solid quantity of quality products? Maybe not 5-6 products every month, but certainly 2-3 is workable.

My personal preference would be to see about three products a month: one rules expansion of some kind, whether a splat, a setting or theme book; one adventure; and one gimmicky product like dungeon tiles or cards of some kind. Then, maybe once a quarter, a nice huge box set - maybe a mega-adventure or a complete campaign setting.

On further remembrance, my players and I used some stuff, but never more than one source book at a time, two at the most (assuming someone didn't want to munchkin the game). The only book that got extensive time at my table was Tome of Battle, and that was very late in 3.5's lifespan. Even so, I doubt that we went through a tenth of 3rd Edition's stuff, and none of us really wanted to.

In this edition however I have almost all the splat books I want, because they're actually useful. It makes a difference getting Primal Power because the amount of options in 4th core are so much larger than in 3.5 (what with powers and such) that those books seem to make a difference in a much bigger way than 3.5's splatbooks. But even then I've found that I've reached my critical mass for "random element" books, because of my lack of physical space to hold it all.

This means that anything I get from now on actually has to have an immediate use or have a cool addition to the game to get my interest. That's why things like the Shadowfell box set thingy catch my eye: they actually do something different and help define a direction in my games. That sort of thing takes more time to develop, but (in theory) would be better selling, because it's an actual addition to the game that, if I decide to add it on, will make things different. That's why they're doing the cards, because they're modular enough to where if I wish to have them they make a real impact.

Modular... that sounds familiar. I think Mearls already got us with cards and the box sets. Damn. That man is clever.

 

[TerraDave]

Deja vu.


My personal preference would be to see about three products a month: one rules expansion of some kind, whether a splat, a setting or theme book; one adventure; and one gimmicky product like dungeon tiles or cards of some kind. Then, maybe once a quarter, a nice huge box set - maybe a mega-adventure or a complete campaign setting.

1 main product a month was the announced approach for 4E, and the actual release schedule came pretty close to what you suggest.

Now, your right, releases are low. Factoring in DDI, they are low (Dragon and Dungeon use to have all sorts of content back in the day). I am not actually complaining, just saying. They are also doing other products to maintain the brand, and that seems like a good thing (I am excited for the new minis).

 

[Gundark]

I think someone corrected this, but to nitpick your nitpick, 4E was announced at Gencon '07 and released in early June of '08.

A nitpick within a nitpick....nitception