L&L 3/05 - Save or Die!

[Harlekin]

PC creation doesn't take 10 minutes in any game, except for the very first session.

Usually you are loosing MONTHS or YEARS of character development when your character dies. And if resurrection is your answer, than why do you need SoD? SoD is not at all scary, if it involves restoring to your last save point.

Death should be meaningful, and not random.

Thank you for making that point. I am always confused whenever I hear someone argue for shorter character creation times. It takes me longer to come up with an interesting background than it takes me to make a PC in any edition of D&D.

And as nightwalker says, the actual character generation happens in game, both as I figure out how to give the character his voice and as the character develops relationships to other PCs and NPCs.

 

[Harlekin]

I must say i am rather amused how concerned people are about simulating the gaze of a Medusa realistically in a game where any fighter can ignore being threatened with a Knife and no trained warrior will ever die from falling of a horse.

D&D always made huge concession to fun ignoring realism in areas where our real life experience actually tells us what should happen.

But apparently making those concessions to the "realism" of a Medusa is a problem even though there is no real Medusa.

 

[Grazzt]

I must say i am rather amused how concerned people are about simulating the gaze of a Medusa realistically in a game where any fighter can ignore being threatened with a Knife and no trained warrior will ever die from falling of a horse.

The knife part true. The horse part, you can fix.

DM: You fall from your horse. I'm rolling 10d6 for damage.
Player: Wait! What!!!??????
DM: It was a big horse.

 

[BryonD]

If not that, then how would you suggest WotC could be inclusive and provide the 'best option?'

I really don't know.

Obviously I would like to see them please me, but you remain "the bird in the hand" and they neglect that at their peril.

In then end what you said meets the criteria I established. So I've no complaint. Whether solving the issue monster-by-monster is the best solution is open to debate. But if they want to throw a really big net then options will be required. This kind of "check the box you like" approach may be the answer.

 

[Hassassin]

I must say i am rather amused how concerned people are about simulating the gaze of a Medusa realistically in a game where any fighter can ignore being threatened with a Knife

The fighter doesn't ignore the knife. That's why it becomes much more lethal when he's helpless and the knife-wielder can coup de grace him.

 

[BryonD]

I must say i am rather amused how concerned people are about simulating the gaze of a Medusa realistically in a game where any fighter can ignore being threatened with a Knife and no trained warrior will ever die from falling of a horse.

D&D always made huge concession to fun ignoring realism in areas where our real life experience actually tells us what should happen.

But apparently making those concessions to the "realism" of a Medusa is a problem even though there is no real Medusa.

"Realism" is a false issue here. But that aside....

There is no precedent for looking at a Medusa and NOT turning to stone. There is vast precedent in heroic literature for characters to avoid would-be fatal knife stabs.

The system I advocate gets fantasy knives correct and gets fantasy Medusa correct. I'm happy with the consistency there.

If you want surprise knife attacks to be moire deadly, check out the Black Company approach in which HP work as normal but under the right circumstances (surprise/crit/etc..) weapon damage is instead applied directly to CON. Suddenly every fight and every STAB is very serious.

I also have long used a falling house rule that every "1" on falling damage dice is 1 CON damage rather than 1 HP damage.

But, again, the bottom line is forget the false standard of "realism" and focus on getting the things to work in the game the same as they do in great stories. Make that change and your complaint here goes away.

 

[Sunseeker]

So yes I agree.
But at the same time I'm personally going to be a bit stingy with those extras saves at my table. To me those become things where, most of the time, the player is responsible for getting their character into (or keeping them out of) the need for saves.

I am certainly all for DM discretion when it comes to the lethality or grittyness of a campaign.

 

[Harlekin]

"Realism" is a false issue here. But that aside....

There is no precedent for looking at a Medusa and NOT turning to stone. There is vast precedent in heroic literature for characters to avoid would-be fatal knife stabs.

There is no precedent for looking at a Medusa. These is a single story about a guy fighting decked out in magic items fighting a Medusa in a very one-sided combat. So all you have is anecdotal evidence here.

 

[Alaxk Knight of Galt]

I also have long used a falling house rule that every "1" on falling damage dice is 1 CON damage rather than 1 HP damage.

This is a great house rule, consider it stolen
I'd XP you for your trouble, but it appears I like your ideas too much

 

[Harlekin]

The fighter doesn't ignore the knife. That's why it becomes much more lethal when he's helpless and the knife-wielder can coup de grace him.

So maybe the Medusa should require a saving throw when the opponent is helpless?