Remember though, the issue isn't that there are encounters in the desert. The issue is that the players CANNOT choose those encounters. There is nothing the players can pro-actively do until the DM allows them to do so. The players cannot go looking for nomads that they have no idea exist. The players cannot go looking for anything. It's a desert. A wasteland where virtually nothing lives. Isn't that generally the definition of a desert or waste?
If there is indeed nohing there then crossing should take no significant table time. I do not agree that "desert" or "wasteland" equals "empty sand pile".
And, you keep talking about how interesting the desert is. That's besides the point though. The ONLY reason we have to be in the desert is because we lack a plot coupon that allows us to skip the desert. If we have the plot coupon, then we skip the desert and no one minds. The only reason that we have to face DM initiated encounters in the desert is because the DM has enforced a level of simulation that I expressly did not want to engage.
Perhaps it illustrates that the PC's lack the control over their environment that more experienced or powerful characters might possess.
I want the centipede travel to be treated the same as teleport. That's what I want. I want this because I want to get to the city and push towards our goal and I don't want to spend time screwing around in the desert. If we had a teleport scroll, I'd use that right away. We don't have that, but, could we please just pretend that using the centipede effectively works the same?
Should we also assume it efectively works like a Fireball, running around an area of effect on command and chomping everyone therein (who take less damage if they succeed in a reflex save, perhaps none if they are skilled in Evasion) because the player now regrets lacking that spell? How many levels above the PC level can the centipede simulate? Finally, I don't think Teleport is the "get out of any travel issues free" card you perceive it as. Why?
- It can transport a limited group (Caster + 1 Medium creature per 3 levels), so not every group can be readily transported in this regard;
- it can transport you a limited distance, but plenty for the 110 mile distance in this example;
- "You must have some clear idea of the location and layout of the destination" - how do you meet that criteria in respect of a city on a different plane, on which you have just arrived, which is an unknown distance between 5 and 500 miles away, in an unknown direction;
- it can fail - each category for that roll assumes you have seen the target destination at least once. Seems like you need to get there under your own power at least once (or, I suppose, scry or get a picture).
- it WILL fail " if you are teleporting to an otherwise familiar location that no longer exists as such or has been so completely altered as to no longer be familiar to you" - how much damage has that siege done?
It has nothing to do with how interesting or boring the desert is. The basic issue here isn't about skipping the DM's interesting stuff, because you don't mind if the group does that. Doesn't bother you in the slightest if the group skips the desert. What bothers you is that the player wants to get the same effect, even though, at this time, he doesn't have the proper plot coupon for doing so. It's a cheat code. This bothers you far more than it does me.
A Wish can solve a wide variety of different challenges, alowing a broad array of different stuff, interesting or not, to be skipped. When I design adventues, I do take PC resources into account. If they have access to Teleport, then I would certainly incorporate that in my scenario design. And if they do not, my scenario design would also consider that. We don't often play out encounters that are trivial, so a 15th level party rarely encounters 3 Orcs. That does not mean the 1st level party can simply skip over the orcs despite not having the "Plot Coupon" of an AC 35 Fighter with 3 attacks per round each of which will almost never miss an Orc and will rarely fail to drop him.
Really? I cannot assume inhabitants in the city? I cannot assume basic elements that the DMG tells us to presume that are in a city of a given size? Again, presuming that those guidelines are being used. If they are not, then whatever guidelines are being used should probably be known to the players as well. Can I assume a 15th level wizard? Ok, probably not. That's going a bit far. But, I probably can assume the presence of a major temple in a city - even if I cannot presume exactly who the temple is devoted to. Which means that I can presume clerics who can cast spells.
You can
assume what you wish. Whether your assumptions are accurate is another question entirely. As an example, I would assume there are Inns in the city. But it may be that the very limited travel through the desert means there are far less inns than I would have assumed. Perhaps the city is insular, even xenophobic, so they aren't accommodating to travellers. That would imply less inns, if any. Perhaps, quite the reverse, they are extremely hospitable to strangers - they bring news from the outside world that is hard to come by. It is, indeed, considered a great honour to host such visitors, and every door in the city is opened wide to travellers, so there are no inns - they would make no money. Or maybe the only Inn is boarded up, as its owner turned out to be a devil (or angel) worshipper, and was recently "evicted" from the city.
You can also
assume the desert is a worthless wasteland, with no meaningful, interesting or relevant encounters. That doesn't mean your assumptions are correct.
Besides sand and rock, what can I pro-actively search out in a desert?
The city that lies within. Isn't that WHY you are in the desert in the first place?
Now, if the siege has absolutely no effect on the inside of the city, I really have to wonder why the DM included it in the first place? What's the point of a siege of a city that has no effect? Why would the DM bother doing all that work for nothing? The siege is there because the players are going to that city. The player's goals are in that city. The siege bloody well better have some effect on those goals, otherwise, what's the point?
Did someone many pages ago not ask similar questions, except that the word "siege" instead read "desert"? It was suggested that the desert could then readily be replaced by a pleasant meadow (or the siege by open gates) if it would have no effect. In other words, "desert bloody well better have some effect on those goals, otherwise, what's the point?"
Could the DM have a completely irrelevant siege? Sure. But, again, what's the point? That's just bad DMing. But, nothing in the desert can be too terribly relevant because it's perfectly reasonable for the group to skip the desert. My group couldn't because we lacked a specific resource, but, it's not like that's a terribly rare resource that no one would ever have. Teleport is a pretty resource common straight out of the PHB.
Sub "desert" for "siege" and vice versa, and little changes.
That it is easy to skip the desert does not automatically render it irrelevant. I guess you arrive at the temple without that new ally you would have encountered in the desert, so you lack that resource. IIRC, the ally in question met you before the Plane Shift, so you need three more levels on that Teleport, or you leave that ally behind (consistent with the "ignore all that is not hostile" strategy). You arrive without any intel those refugees, or nomads, or what have you, may have provided.
It sounds like in the AP in question, the characters were expected to wander the desert. Can anyone familiar with the specific scenario tell us why Teleport was not an automatic "Get Out of Desert Travel Free" card? I assume it was not, but such a hole in the scenario is hardly impossible. I suspect the party isn't 9th level, as it sounds like they needed this NPC to cast Plane Shift, a 5th level Cleric spell.
What's not true? That it's perfectly reasonable for the group to skip the desert? We've already established that it is. It's the one constant in this thread. If the group had teleport, they would skip the desert and that was perfectly fine. No one in this thread has the slightest problem with skipping the desert. Skipping the desert is only a problem if the PC's lack the in game resources to do so.
What's actually in the desert doesn't actually matter. It cannot matter since skipping it is perfectly fine. Nothing in the desert can be necessary to what comes after the desert. If it was necessary, then there would be problems skipping the desert. But there aren't. Skipping the desert is perfectly fine. The only actual problem is that I want to skip the desert but I don't have the proper, rules sanctioned plot coupon to do so.
That you can skip it does not equate to "it does not matter". You can choose not to interact with a chatty innkeeper. That does not render the information he could have imparted irrelevant, it just means you don't have that information. Thats perfectly fine. Although, I suppose, I can change the innkeeper to a chatty drunk locked up in the local prison where your character (arrested for violation of some trumped up charge) is spending the night. Absent a "plot coupon", you'll be listening to him, although I suppose you could stick your fingers in your ears and loudly chant LALALALALALA all night long, to avoid any risk of interaction. And you then lack any info he could have imparted. Tough luck. Maybe that means you don't find out he knows how to contact the secret congregation of Good Deity in the city. If that frustrates your ability to achieve your goals, so be it.
Now, a good GM will not have only one possible means for accomplishing a critical goal, and especially not one that is easily skipped (eg. by a party that has, and perhaps routinely uses, Teleport for travel). But that doesn't obligate the game world, or the GM, to bend to your whims and ensure that whatever avenue you choose to pursue, all of the resources you need or desire to accomplish your goals will tumble from that. When you can't locate that secret temple, perhaps your investigations lead back to that old drunk. Maybe your investigations lead you to a merchant who left town with that caravan you walked past, ignoring their hails, or to a nomad tribe or lost temple in the desert.
That is the fundamental issue here. You could have the most interesting or the most boring desert in the entire history of gaming, and it still doesn't matter. Because it's perfectly acceptable to skip the desert, the desert can NEVER be very relevant to the city. Sure, it might be tangentially relevant - foreshadowing and whatnot. But, then again, who cares? The party is going to learn about the siege as soon as they teleport. We didn't exactly need a couple of hours of interacting with various desert scenarios to establish something that's going to be discovered in the first ten seconds of the next scene.
As indicated above, you skipping an encounter, by whatever means, does not render that encounter irelevant. It means you do not benefit from whatever relevance it may have had. I do agree a prudent GM would not rely on PC's who have the ability to avoid the desert (or the siege, or the city) entirely choosing to interact with it when they have no reason to do so. This would be where investigations in the city could lead us back out into the desert (or to speak with the siege general, or to travel to the city in the first place).
IOW, the fact that you have the ability to skip the desert does not mean it can be skipped with impunity. It means you can avoid all encounters in the desert, avoiding all benefits and drawbacks of those encounters. If one of those encounters included a wise old priest who would have Blessed your endeavours, providing you with a bonus to be used later, and you skipped the desert, or just ignored his greeting when passing him in the desert, then you lack that bonus. Maybe that means your quest fails (a Grell kills the whole party because you lack the extra AC the old sage's Ward would have provided). Maybe it has not marked effect (you easily defeat the Grell without the bonuses from good planning or good luck). Maybe it made the task more difficult and costly (you beat the Grell, but a PC was killed).
IOW,
The fact many groups could skip the desert with relative ease does not mean your group won't find useful resources, intelligence, or aid traversing it. Those are the possibilities gained by going the scenic route. The desert is only as irrelevant as the table makes it. Automatically ignoring non-hostile encounters will go a long way to making it irrelevant though.
