D&D 5E Replacing Damage-On-A-Miss

[DEFCON 1]

I am very much a fan of the Brutal property, although Advantage on the damage roll would work for me too. In both cases though... we'd have to find out if the extra damage gained would be too much or not enough to be the equivalent of a similar ability in one of the other weapon styles.

 

[Ashkelon]

A lot of these go against the design philosophy of 5e.

They are trying to get away from a lot of fiddly minuses and pluses to rolls. No single modifier is "too much" but the combination is what causes the issue, and the easiest way to deal with that is to prevent as many as possible from entering the game. These are just two more, so against the design philosophy of the game.

Umm...tell that to the entire feat section. You know, the section littered with feats that allow you to take a -5 penalty to your attack to get some other effect.

Another design philosophy is to get away from the battlegrid and promote theater of the mind style of play. Pushing 5 feet is definitely a battle-grid type ability, and therefore against the design philosophy of the game.

Again, look at feats, spells, and even the basic combat rules. There are many many many abilities that push creatures 5-15 feet, and are significantly more beneficial to groups playing with a grid. In fact, because most spells are measured in 5 foot increments, it makes not using a grid very difficult in 5e, unlike say 13th Age which is actually designed around TotM.

A third design philosophy is bounded accuracy applying to both attack bonus and AC. A single +1 to attacks is now seen as a major thing, not a minor one. So again, this goes against one of the design philosophies of 5e.

Well, except for the two existing fighting styles that already do just that! Archery fighting style is +1 attacks, and defensive fighting style is +1 AC.

How can my proposed suggestion be against the spirit of 5e, if 5e is already doing all of those to a much worse degree!

 

[sheadunne]

Roll 2d20
If High Hits - Strength Damage Only
If Low Hits - Normal Damage
If Both Miss - No damage

 

[Savage Wombat]

Why can't we have great weapons that work like they did in the real world, instead of focusing on fantasy combat? Have greatswords work against cavalry and pikes or something.

 

[Derren]

Why can't we have great weapons that work like they did in the real world, instead of focusing on fantasy combat? Have greatswords work against cavalry and pikes or something.

Because such weapons need a more complex combat system than what 5E is willing to implement with weapon reach, armor penetration, etc.

 

[GravyFingerz]

As I said on the other thread, I'd like to see sweeping damage, where any damage over the excess to kill a monster is applied to another creature within reach (assuming the original attack roll was sufficient enough to hit the new target's AC.)

 

[TwoSix]

Why can't we have great weapons that work like they did in the real world, instead of focusing on fantasy combat? Have greatswords work against cavalry and pikes or something.

Yes.

 

[Gadget]

Why can't we have great weapons that work like they did in the real world, instead of focusing on fantasy combat? Have greatswords work against cavalry and pikes or something.

D&D has always been about fantasy combat, not detailed historical combat sim. And it is not just a great swords, but most two-handed, non-pole arm, melee weapons. How often do your characters go against calvary and pikes anyway?

 

[I'm A Banana]

Some interesting themes emerging!

Better Average Damage:

Advantage on your damage roll, if you hit.

Or what about a damage minimum threshold akin to the 4E Brutal property?

These would work, but they seem a little blah to me personally. A little too close to the "here's a cookie because you sucked" feel in that they mitigate low rolls. Functional, not too flashy.

Kockback:

I've been thinking of some sort of Sweep ability, where the two-handed fighter forces one or more opponents to use their reaction to get out of the way (by stepping back, going prone, taking cover) or suffer some damage.

1) Knockback on a miss
When you miss a target with a two handed or versatile weapon wielded in two hands, the target must move 5 feet away from you. If unable, the target is knocked prone.

Definitely flashier...but might not really matter much in practice. Getting back into melee is pretty trivial, and a melee monster will WANT to be in melee where possible! Hmm...

Unstoppable Forces:

When you make a melee attack, you may impose a -5 penalty to your attack roll to compare the result to the AC of all creatures within 5 feet of you. Each creature with an AC equal or less than your attack roll is hit by the attack, both friend and foe. Roll damage only once for each attack.

3) Backswing
When you attack with a two handed weapon or a versatile weapon wielded in two hands on your turn, you can make one improvised weapon attack against another creature adjacent to you.

As I said on the other thread, I'd like to see sweeping damage, where any damage over the excess to kill a monster is applied to another creature within reach (assuming the original attack roll was sufficient enough to hit the new target's AC.)

I like the vibe of an area attack. But then, I liked Cleave, which is sort of an area attack...hmm...and not necessarily something that'll be fun to spam, but some of these work better than others. Hurm. Still probably one of my favorite ideas, personally. I like Talath's version best so far -- easy peasy lemon squeezy. A bit metagame, but not enough to bug me.

Others:

2) Destabilizing Swing
When you miss a target with a two handed or versatile weapon wielded in two hands, you can add you Strength modifier to the damage of your next attack that hits that creature.

Why not just add 2xSTR to one hit? Bigger! MOAR!

4) Damage or Dodge on a miss
When you miss a target with a two handed or versatile weapon wielded in two hands, the creature still takes damage unless they give up their ability to make reactions until the start of your next turn. If they do not, they are dealt damage equal to your Strength modifier.

So in this hypothetical it'd just look like making an enemy give up its reaction when hit....which is interesting...and fits the "you're off-balance from being hit with a 7-foot slab of metal and you're going to need a minute to focus again" vibe...

It's something that would benefit from a more standard status that got rid of your reactions. A "stunned" or "flat-footed" status or somesuch. But then we might have a bit for the "condition stacking" crowd to be unhappy with...still, I'm kind of fascinated by this idea.

What about a death threshold mechanic akin to the 4E Assassin Executioner feature?

Not bad....death is a big thing to have happen, and this gets rid of that annoying "I've got 2 hp left!" quality. A little abstract for some tastes, a little like "nothing happens for 5 hits, then BAM...if I'm the one to kill it." I like it for some reasons, don't like it for others...hmm...

Why can't we have great weapons that work like they did in the real world, instead of focusing on fantasy combat? Have greatswords work against cavalry and pikes or something.

Well, we focus on fantasy combat because in a fantasy RPG, that's where our fantasy weapons come into play. It's also a little hard on someone who wants to be a specialist to have such a limited class of "favored enemies," and a bit fiddly for anyone who isn't a specialist, to give a gameplay reason. Still, if your goal is realism, I guess that's how that would work?

 

[Minigiant]

5) Circleswing
When you attack with a two handed or versatile weapon wielded in two hands, creatures within 5 feet of you have disadvantage.

6) Momentous swing
When you miss a target with a two handed or versatile weapon wielded in two hands, your next attack with that weapon until the end of your next turn has advantage.