D&D 5E Magic stone (EE/PotA cantrip) doesn't scale with level

[doctorhook]

Princes of the Apocalypse includes the magic stone cantrip for druids. As a bonus action, you can temporarily enchant up to three stones to deal 1d6 + your spellcasting ability modifier in bludgeoning damage. You can throw these stones or sling them at enemies, but you allies can also use them too (with your spellcasting modifier as their attack bonus).

Unlike other cantrips, magic stone does not improve with level. At 5th level, all the other damage cantrips begin to deal two damage dice, for example; magic stone still only does 1d6 + mod bludgeoning damage for three stones, all the way up to 20th level. That doesn't seem right, but I can't tell if there's a hidden purpose here.

Can anybody tell me what's going on with this cantrip? Does anyone think this spell would break if it gained bonus dice as the caster levels? Thanks for your input.

 

[Paraxis]

Just like shillelagh another druid cantrip magic stone is dependent on the number of attacks you can make to do extra damage.

An 11th level fighter with this cantrip could bonus action cast then throw all three stones on his turn. That is how it scales.

This means it doesn't scale for single class druids.

 

[Kobold Stew]

Even working the way it does, it does not allow for it to stack with rogue's Sneak Attack. That's always a good benchmark, I find, for detecting "brokenness". They've worked really hard to ensure no cantrip works with SA. Rightly or wrongly, they are working to curb powercreep.

 

[bganon]

Yes, think of cantrip scaling as the caster's version of the Extra Attack feature for fighter-types -- you don't get both. If the cantrip scales, it doesn't use the Attack action; if you make the actual attack using the Attack action, the damage doesn't scale.

 

[I'm A Banana]

Cantrips = weapons.

Extra damage from cantrips = extra attacks with weapons.

Cantrips that give you weapons don't need to scale with damage - they can benefit from extra attacks.

 

[abirdcall]

It would be fun if they gave you more enchantments per casting.

 

[Kobold Stew]

Cantrips = weapons.

I don't think that is the intention (nor the actual wording), and (again) the case of Sneak Attack is the argument I'd put forward. The game is pretty consistent about differentiating between, e.g., a ranged attack and a ranged spell attack, and when it's a spell attack, it's not an attack with a weapon.

So (by my reading) none of the scaling attack cantrips count, nor do the two non-scaling ones (shillelagh and magic stone). It could have been otherwise: delete the word "spell" from the description of magic stone, and nothing changes, except for the fact that the thrown pebble counts now as a weapon. But they chose not to do that.

 

[Syntallah]

I don't think that is the intention (nor the actual wording), and (again) the case of Sneak Attack is the argument I'd put forward. The game is pretty consistent about differentiating between, e.g., a ranged attack and a ranged spell attack, and when it's a spell attack, it's not an attack with a weapon.

So (by my reading) none of the scaling attack cantrips count, nor do the two non-scaling ones (shillelagh and magic stone). It could have been otherwise: delete the word "spell" from the description of magic stone, and nothing changes, except for the fact that the thrown pebble counts now as a weapon. But they chose not to do that.

I don't think that's what Kamikaze Midget meant. I believe he meant that Cantrips are the equivalent of weapons. A slight distinction, but a significant one...

 

[Kobold Stew]

If so, I had missed that, in the process of riding my own hobby horse...

 

[I'm A Banana]

I don't think that's what Kamikaze Midget meant. I believe he meant that Cantrips are the equivalent of weapons. A slight distinction, but a significant one...

Bingo!

It's something that's come up in a few threads where people are annoyed that sorcerers don't get better weapon proficiencies. A cantrip is in most cases the rough equal if not the better of weapon proficiencies (mechanically, a spear don't do anything a shocking grasp can't do, using your primary ability score and a non-piercing damage type and...). They're roughly equal in action economy, roughly equal in accuracy and damage potential, roughly equal all 'round.