D&D 5E Perfect example of the kind of interaction that I wish Wizards had with it's community.

[pemerton]

I am still waiting on this CCG "lie" they told.

And you'll wait a long time.

Is that because [MENTION=3586]MerricB[/MENTION] has shown there was no lie, and that WotC did describe them as collectable?

Here's Mike Mearls in an interview on Fortune cards: http://www.livingdice.com/5029/wiza...iew-part-2-of-2-dd-gamma-world-fortune-cards/

"MM: Similar to Gamma World cards, we are going to be doing fortune cards for D&D. They are collectible cards that give the same kind of random dramatic element to the game. The player can alter the action a little bit by using a random benefit. As a whole they make the game a little more unpredictable and makes things work out in an interesting new way.

"Also like the Gamma World cards, they aren’t designed to build an optimized deck to get a more powerful character. they are designed to be random and add chaos to the game."

Mike calls them collectible.

Here's part of the original press release: http://geek-news.mtv.com/2011/02/01/dungeons-dragons-fortune-cards-to-debut-february-2011/
"Available in 8-card booster packs with differing levels of rarity, D&D Fortune Cards serve as another avenue for excitement around the game table. Whether players collect them all, or just use two or three boosters to build a deck, a player’s tactical options for their character will change and expand in interesting ways."

Oh look - 'collect them all'.

 

[Kramodlog]

Is that because MerricB has shown there was no lie, and that WotC did describe them as collectable?

I'm chagrine by the tone of the orders I was adressed. Give give give they said! Who gives orders nowadays anyway? What about my feelings? My dignaty? The rest of my gospel? Thrown in the garbage, ignored, only to focus on a word: game. Then, to focus on another.

Oh the pain, the pain of it all! Maybe I should drink hemlock!

No Goldo, do not stop. You went out of the cavern and saw the world. It is your duty to go back down and to tell them it is shadows they are seeing. Yes, you will be persecuted, stoned and whipped, but what is more important you or truth?




Or I'm lazy.

 

[fjw70]

When the team that worked/is working on it gets the news it won't be published? Considering WotC sent the cover art to a retailer three weeks before the cancellation was made public and the AP was officially announced, I would say the work was done by then.

And you'll wait a long time.

Sure.

Yeah, Defcon1's comment is a terrible starting point. It is the son of a strawman and a drunken hyperbole. It exist only by itself. Mearls response to the cancellation was the problem. Not the cancellation itself. Saying people acted like 2 years old is a personal attack, not an argument. Who acted like a 2 year old in this thread? DDI was aggravating because it didn't provide what it advertized to paying customers. That is a breach of confidence. A pretty clear bad interaction. If you want to argue otherwise, please explain why refunds were needed at one point. Cause too many paying customers were poopie 2 years old?

I responded to you who was responding to your question. I provided a list of which only one point as been contested. Not too shabby.

And if we avoid acting like two years old, so what if we admit WotC had bad interactions with fans? The idea is not to make it go bankrupt. It is to share the displeasure generated and maybe prevent other butthurt. Butthurt is a serious condition that affect more and more Westerners, you know.

What is the sense it is being used?

Again we were talking about people "that did nothing but rip WotC a new one over and over any time something wasn't released in the exact form they had mentioned months or years before." That is the bad behavior we were discussing. We weren't talking about being disappointed with changing product catalogues.

So let me rephrase the question I asked. What did WotC do to encourage the immature behavior that many fans exhibited on this board and many others?

You have already been wrong about them lying about fortune cards.

You still haven't answered how far along in the development process a product has to be to be considered a cancelled product if it is not released.

Do you know that WotC send the cover art to the retailer? Or is this another unsubstantiated assumption you are making?

To sum up, WotC didn't lie and provided good customer service by refunding disappointed fans.

 

[Kramodlog]

Again we were talking about people "that did nothing but rip WotC a new one over and over any time something wasn't released in the exact form they had mentioned months or years before." That is the bad behavior we were discussing. We weren't talking about being disappointed with changing product catalogues.

So let me rephrase the question I asked. What did WotC do to encourage the immature behavior that many fans exhibited on this board and many others?

Let me say that what you are doing is immature behavior. You're ignoring everything I said to focus on Defcon1's strawman-hyperbole. No one riped WotC a new one. No one acted like a 2 years old.

Adress the actual arguments that have been made. I made a list. What about each points? That seems to be your major issue.

You have already been wrong about them lying about fortune cards.

When did you prove that? What about the rest of the list? Can you demonstrate it or will you hyper focus on one element? Surely you ment more then once.

You still haven't answered how far along in the development process a product has to be to be considered a cancelled product if it is not released.

I do not have to. That is not necessary. I already showed when it can be cancelled. When the design team learns the product they have been working on won't see the light of day. That is a cancellation. If you disagree, explain why.

Do you know that WotC send the cover art to the retailer?

Yes. We all do. ENworld made sure of that. http://www.enworld.org/forum/conten...k-and-Princes-of-the-Apocalypse!#.VTnkpiF_Oko

Seriously, this argument is old. It makes me realizeyou are not well informed about what WotC is doing.

 

[fjw70]

We can't ignore what Defcon said because that is the discussion you responded to. I am glad you agree WotC did not encourage the behavior Defcon mentions. Again we weren't talking about people being disappointed with WotC.

What points of yours have I ignored? Your unsubstantiated accusation of lying? Your refusal to define at what point in a product's development cycle an unannounced product can be considered canceled? Your point that people were disappointed with a changing product catalogue?

I clicked your link about the covers and didn't see anything that substantiated your claim that WotC sent them to the retailer (but I didn't read the entire 200 post thread).

So since I don't accept your unsubstantiated accusations I am not well informed about what WotC is doing? Okay . . .

To be honest I don't track every statement WotC makes and don't get all butthurt if an off-hand comment is made and not followed up on.

I think I have said my peace. Good night.

 

[justinj3x3]

Your refusal to define at what point in a product's development cycle an unannounced product can be considered canceled?
.

No offense, but like I said before, debating this is just debating semantics. The thing was planned and it got canceled. Period. To say anything else is just nonsense. Yes I'm looking at you Mearls. And to parrot Mearls claim, to me, seems like someone being a WOTC mouthpiece or blind worshiping.

 

[Shasarak]

It's the "right flank and rear" that require miniatures.

Why? Especially in ADnD where rounds are 1 minute in length without any "shifting" abilities or 5 foot steps to get flanking. Remember that you are not supposed to be standing in one place slugging it out with each other.

 

[DEFCON 1]

Let me say that what you are doing is immature behavior. You're ignoring everything I said to focus on Defcon1's strawman-hyperbole. No one ripped WotC a new one. No one acted like a 2 years old...

WHAT?!?

{shakes head in disbelief}

Okay, goldomark... now you're just trolling us.

 

[DEFCON 1]

No offense, but like I said before, debating this is just debating semantics. The thing was planned and it got canceled. Period. To say anything else is just nonsense. Yes I'm looking at you Mearls. And to parrot Mearls claim, to me, seems like someone being a WOTC mouthpiece or blind worshiping.

Thankfully... this is exactly why Mike ignores all of us 99.9% of the time. Because we don't deserve to be talked to.

 

[justinj3x3]

Thankfully... this is exactly why Mike ignores all of us 99.9% of the time. Because we don't deserve to be talked to.

Excuse me? Heaven forbid I express my opinion. That makes me not deserving of being spoken to? Last I checked we all have opinions and a right to express them. SHAME ON YOU for attacking me for expressing my opinion.


"To suppress free speech is a double wrong. It violates the rights of the hearer as well as those of the speaker." Frederick Douglass

“If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
George Orwell

Seriously shame on you. Have more respect for opinions that differ from yours. Even if you disagree.