D&D 5E Opinions on Bladesinger

[Edwin Suijkerbuijk]

Barbarian: AC 17, 55 HP, 2x +7 for d10+6 (+2 for d10+16), can Reckless Attack, resistance to all (I know he doesn't resist the Githyanki's psychic damage but let's pretend he does, for the sake of analysis), gets bonus d4 attack and gets a reaction attack in mob scenario
Bladesinger: AC 21, 32 HP, 2x +7 for d8+4 (or +7 for 2d8+4, 2d8+4 to 2nd creature with Greenflame Blade), can Mirror Image or Blur, can Shield

I think you made a small error.
At 5th level the damage to the 2nd creature from green flame blade is 1d8+ ability mod.

 

[Devilbass]

Hemlock,

Thanks for crunching some numbers. This seems to align pretty closely with what I thought: the Bladesinger is an effective melee character, and with the expenditure of a spell or two, the Bladesinger becomes very effective, but not so much as to obsolete other melee classes.

Compared to most other melee characters though, the Bladesinger will need to be very wary of creatures that grapple or knock prone. Seems like a fair trade-off though, given the Bladesinger's utility through class abilities and spells.

 

[Mirtek]

Compared to most other melee characters though, the Bladesinger will need to be very wary of creatures that grapple or knock prone.

can't you counter grapple with dex?

 

[Devilbass]

Mirtek, you're completely right, I forgot that Dex(Acrobatics) could be used to contest being grappled and to escape a grapple. So it's really just the Strength saves vs proning. Not really a glaring enough weakness to be too concerned about though.

 

[psychophipps]

So by being smart, I'm somehow negating the other abilities? Every ability isn't going to apply to every situation, my friends. It was shown in the Orc battle above that the other three abilities are a great boon. Againt a Githyanki Knight? Not so much. Now add that a more traditional Wizard build can't kite this Knight close to as efficiently, and the versatility of the Bladesinger really comes out.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

One of my players is thinking about making a Bladesinger. We’ll see how it goes. I’m not sure I like the path, but to each their own. It's looking like the group will be weak on front-line characters, so the additional melee abilities could come in handy.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

But I'm going to miss my current Abjurer's Ward and especially Improved Abjuration. She's basically able to swat down opposing spells at will while still having the slots to blast and remove enemies and do out of combat utility. Seriously. Enemy casts a ninth-level spell at her, she burns a third-level slot and about 75% of the time kills the spell.

While I understand the attraction of a high Counterspell bonus, I don't think it's likely to work out that way in practice. The 9th level spell you're likely to be most afraid of in a typical party is Meteor Swarm: 140 damage on everybody, save for half. Meteor Swarm has a one-mile (5280') range. Counterspell has a 60' range. Odds are that if somebody is Meteor Swarming you, they're way out of Counterspell range.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

Hemlock, Githyanki Knights move 30' per turn. Is there a particular reason why the Tranced Bladesinger isn't just constantly dancing away and peppering it with Firebolts/<insert random damage cantrip here>?

1.) I'm AFB, but I believe Githyanki all have Misty Step, which kills that strategy, at least in close terrain.
2.) People on these forums get weird about melee kiting--it tends to start arguments over what the terrain is, how big rooms are, who has surprise, what visual range is, etc.
3.) Nevertheless, you are correct that 40' movement is a big advantage which is often overlooked. Even if you're already in melee with a githyanki knight as a bladesinger, you could choose to eat one opportunity attack by moving 40' away, in order to deny the githyanki his multiattack on his turn. If he didn't have Misty Step this would cut your damage taken by 50%, but since he does it instead increases your damage taken by 50%.
4.) You're right that Fire Bolt + kiting is a better strategy for the bladesinger, but that's equally true for any wizard, because Expeditious Retreat and/or Longstrider. The numbers were intended to focus on pure melee DPR, but kiting is part of that "bladesinger is a full wizard" aspect I mentioned under Additional Factors.

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

I think you made a small error.
At 5th level the damage to the 2nd creature from green flame blade is 1d8+ ability mod.

Thank you, good catch.

 

[Prism]

1.) I'm AFB, but I believe Githyanki all have Misty Step, which kills that strategy, at least in close terrain.

Yup, there is no getting away from a Githyanki knight very easily - three misty steps per day