D&D 5E Eberron popularity in 5E

[Corpsetaker]

I think that Eberron is popular but just not popular enough.

I think if Wizards actually put some focus on Eberron lot's of people would actually like it. Unfortunately they aren't really worried about the RPG and instead have their sights set on something bigger and they believe FR will get them there.

 

[Remathilis]

YI think your assessment is pretty reasonable, but it's so pessimistic. I guess I don't want to believe that Eberron is too different to ever see some quality support.

Honestly, I know SCAG isn't very popular (for some good reasons), but I could be satisfied by an Eberron product of that size. I don't need any new Eberron fluff, but I'd still buy it if it had a decent 5E treatment of the Eberron races, the artificer, dragonmarks, and Eberron magic items like bound-elemental and dragonshard stuff. (It doesn't need psionics in it, and psionics deserves it own treatment anyway.) I could even be satisfied with this product if it was digital only. Right now, it definitely feels like Eberron is starving to death...

My initial optimism has been dissuaded by the WotC Wall of Silence (second level evocation). I assumed the Eberron Playtest Doc from Jan/Feb of this year was a precursor to some Eberron support; but its seeming more and more that its all we're getting for a while. They could surprise me and announce an EAG, but who knows? We won't until 3 months before its released. I want some bare-minimum support for Eberron (just enough to convert the major features of the setting) but I'm afraid I don't know if/when that will happen. Lather-rinse-repeat for nearly every other setting with material not found in the core rules.

 

[Remathilis]

I think if Wizards actually put some focus on Eberron lot's of people would actually like it. Unfortunately they aren't really worried about the RPG and instead have their sights set on something bigger and they believe FR will get them there.

I don't think its as much FR is the their ticket to something bigger as much as its really the setting of least resistance.

* Dark Sun, Ravenloft, and Planescape are all "nontraditional" fantasy settings and don't represent the "typical" D&D experience.
* Dragonlance and Eberron are closer, having been home to either successful novels or video games, but have nonstandard elements and tweaks that change the assumptions of the core game.
* Greyhawk and Mystara are both "generic", but suffer from being barely-detailed skeletons of a setting that are better known for their iconic adventures than anything about the world itself.
* Nentir Vale has every problem GH/Mystara has, plus its stymied for being conceived of in 4e.
* Forgotten Realms is richly detailed, home to several successful novel series and video games, and doesn't violate or require parts of the Core Rules to be changed in order to play.

So Forgotten Realms has all the advantages of Dragonlance and Eberron (success in other media) and Greyhawk and Mystara (generic, core rules based setting) and few if any of any of their disadvantages. From a branding standpoint, its a no-brainer. A gamer can get into the setting via multiple avenues (gaming, novels, video games, or the upcoming movie) and get a detailed, if generic, experience. It's harder to do if, say, Eberron is the MMO setting, Dragonlance is the movie setting, and the current AP is in Dark Sun; people will wonder why my mmo PC is an artificer, the movie had kender (which aren't in the PHB) and the module I just bought is happening in a giant desert with stone weapons.

I can't honestly fault WotC for making FR leader of the pack, but I still hope we get some other pack members as well.

 

[MerricB]

I can't honestly fault WotC for making FR leader of the pack, but I still hope we get some other pack members as well.

I'm sure we'll get more setting stuff in future. Absolutely, 100% sure. It's probably worth remembering that 5E hasn't actually be around for that long: it hasn't been 16 months yet since the release of the core rulebooks and Hoard of the Dragon Queen.

Princes of the Apocalypse gave suggestions for running the adventure in other settings. Out of the Abyss is set in the Underdark (and could be transplanted into a lot of settings).

Now we're getting very strong indications that one of the next two adventures (I'd imagine the second, just because its release will be closer to Halloween) will be set in Ravenloft. And there's discussion about other settings as well.

So, let's assume we get a Ravenloft adventure. Will we also get a Campaign Setting guide? The big question is this: do we need one? The primary reason for doing a new Ravenloft Setting book is to update the mechanics we need in Ravenloft. That might be handled in the adventure. At that point - assuming the older campaign setting books are on dndclassics.com - the need to actually print a campaign book isn't so high. It'd be nice to have one, but given one of the chief objections to the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide is "we already have this material", just doing a setting book is something that isn't as automatic as it has been in previous editions.

If the timeline gets updated (as with SCAG), that strengthens the case for a new book. (That works a bit against Eberron, which was meant to never be updated... but there may be enough mechanics to warrant as stand-alone book!)

I also believe that Wizards do have more flexibility than most people assume; they can break the mold of how they release books and release more if they think such are warranted, but they are paying a lot of attention to what we're saying and they're not going to rush into things.

Cheers!

 

[MerricB]

Recently there's been some discussion about what settings people are playing in 5E. WotC indicated that most people are playing FR...

There seems to be this assumption that Wizards data on setting play is based on 5E play only. The impression I have is that the data is from a much longer period than that.

 

[BlueBlackRed]

I'd much rather have monster manuals or players options long before a setting was made.

From what I've seen of SCAG, it's a waste of my money. And I'm certainly not interested in Eberron.

 

[Remathilis]

I'm sure we'll get more setting stuff in future. Absolutely, 100% sure. It's probably worth remembering that 5E hasn't actually be around for that long: it hasn't been 16 months yet since the release of the core rulebooks and Hoard of the Dragon Queen.

Princes of the Apocalypse gave suggestions for running the adventure in other settings. Out of the Abyss is set in the Underdark (and could be transplanted into a lot of settings).

Now we're getting very strong indications that one of the next two adventures (I'd imagine the second, just because its release will be closer to Halloween) will be set in Ravenloft. And there's discussion about other settings as well.

So, let's assume we get a Ravenloft adventure. Will we also get a Campaign Setting guide? The big question is this: do we need one? The primary reason for doing a new Ravenloft Setting book is to update the mechanics we need in Ravenloft. That might be handled in the adventure. At that point - assuming the older campaign setting books are on dndclassics.com - the need to actually print a campaign book isn't so high. It'd be nice to have one, but given one of the chief objections to the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide is "we already have this material", just doing a setting book is something that isn't as automatic as it has been in previous editions.

If the timeline gets updated (as with SCAG), that strengthens the case for a new book. (That works a bit against Eberron, which was meant to never be updated... but there may be enough mechanics to warrant as stand-alone book!)

I also believe that Wizards do have more flexibility than most people assume; they can break the mold of how they release books and release more if they think such are warranted, but they are paying a lot of attention to what we're saying and they're not going to rush into things.

Cheers!

Man, I hope you're right (especially about the Ravenloft next Autumn, I'd pre-order that right now!)

That said, Ravenloft and Planescape are kinda unique in that a.) their planar natures allow them to easy crossover with the Realms and b.) there is not a lot of necessary material to convert for either. Ravenloft needs Fear, Horror, and Madness (all in the DMG), Power Checks, the changes to spellcasting, magic items, and class powers (a fairly small list if done right) and maybe curses. You could fit all that in 20-30 pages. With Planescape, thanks to the info on the planes in the DMG, all you need is factions and maybe a few races (bariaur, maybe reprint genasi and aasimar) which could be done in a EEPG supplement. The rest (like Sigil) is all setting. I fully expect those two will be on the docket sooner rather than later.

Eberron, Dark Sun, and Dragonlance are all much cloudier. They aren't easily accessible from FR, play with a lot of core assumptions, and have unique elements (races and monsters) that require updating. They aren't "AP and supplement", they're full campaign guide necessary. It might be possible to see one or all of them, but i don't expect it anytime soon (if at all).

 

[doctorhook]

My initial optimism has been dissuaded by the WotC Wall of Silence (second level evocation). I assumed the Eberron Playtest Doc from Jan/Feb of this year was a precursor to some Eberron support; but its seeming more and more that its all we're getting for a while. They could surprise me and announce an EAG, but who knows? We won't until 3 months before its released. I want some bare-minimum support for Eberron (just enough to convert the major features of the setting) but I'm afraid I don't know if/when that will happen. Lather-rinse-repeat for nearly every other setting with material not found in the core rules.

Yeah, I concur with your assessment. Honestly, I've been reasonably faithful to WotC of the years and taken their PR in good faith, but only in the past year (during the best edition of D&D, even) have I really started to get frustrated with the level of communication from WotC to the fans. I understand 100% if they don't want to announce products far ahead of time, that's okay, but I the monthly survey feedback and the sparsity of interaction with fans has made me seriously wonder what the hell they're actually planning. So much of the communication we do get is about non-tabletop things like Sword Coast Legends, which wouldn't have been so bad if that basket of WotC's eggs wasn't so rotten.

I don't know, I'm just annoyed by the level of support WotC is putting into D&D, I guess.

There seems to be this assumption that Wizards data on setting play is based on 5E play only. The impression I have is that the data is from a much longer period than that.

Out of curiosity, what gave that impression?

I'd much rather have monster manuals or players options long before a setting was made.

From what I've seen of SCAG, it's a waste of my money. And I'm certainly not interested in Eberron.

Thank you for your contribution to this conversation.

 

[MerricB]

Out of curiosity, what gave that impression?

When Chris was talking about which campaign settings get used, he was also talking about why there was only one Birthright adventure in Dragon magazine - a setting that was release 20 years ago, and hasn't been supported much since. There's other things as well, but it's also my overall impression of having carefully studied how Wizards have done things since 2000...

Cheers!

 

[Jester David]

As settings go, Eberron is trickier than most. The big catch is that all its fans already have the books. And since the setting has explicitly not changed due to the adventures or novels 100% of past lore is still usable so there's less incentive to buy a new book. Even Eberron fans are not a guaranteed sale for a product.

There is some crunch to be updated, but that could all fit into a book the size of the Elemental Evil Players Companion. Anything more is literal filler; more content for the sake of content. But something that size doesn't fit well in stores since there's no spine to make visible on shelves. And they can do stuff like the UA articles. Or let the fans use Keith Baker's updates.
(The lack of updates on Unearthed Arcana content is annoying, but I'm not sure of an easy way to update without losing an article for the month. And I'd like to see the Basttlesystem rules updated first.)

Really, not every Eberron campaign even uses those races or makes use of PCs as members of dragonmark houses. You could play a lot of games with the PHB.