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D&D 5E Could Tongues Work on an Ape?

Jer

Legend
Supporter
We play again in two weeks and I'm going to ask my DM and ultimately it's up to him but what do you guys think?

My advice is to ask your DM sooner rather than later. If you spring it on him right before you want to do it, you're more likely to get a "no" because the DM won't have thought it over and his initial reaction will likely be colored by the fact that he has a whole lot of different stuff planned and a talking Mongo wasn't part of any contingencies he'd planned for. If you give him time to think about it he might spot some potential story ideas that would make him more likely to say yes - and also give him time to get over any "talking animals are inherently silly" reactions he may have.

Once you have DM buy-in it really doesn't matter what those of us here in the peanut gallery say about the "rules as written" or not. And without DM buy-in the same is true. It's the kind of question that is all about worldbuilding and the story of the party rather than combat balance, and so what your table decides to do may be very different from what my table decides to do. (Personally I'd probably allow it so long as the players involved had an idea of where they wanted it to go and weren't expecting me to come up with some elaborate back-story for Mongo myself. I'd want to know what that backstory was beforehand too - both to tweak it a bit if it didn't fit in with any of the gameworld secrets I was keeping from them and to see if they'd stuck in any story hooks for me to hang a game session or two on. But that's me - different DMs are going to have different attitudes to stuff like that.)
 

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mrpopstar

Sparkly Dude
I think it's meaningful that most beasts are unintelligent and lack any society or language, meaningful that only druids, rangers, clerics who choose the Nature domain, and paladins who take the Oath of the Ancients have speak with animals on their spell lists, and meaningful that themes, tropes, and niches exist.

As a Dungeon Master, I rule to reinforce what I think is meaningful.

:)
 

mrpopstar

Sparkly Dude
Someone should definitely tweet at Crawford, though.

It appears as if apes are too intelligent for the effects of the awaken spell, but not intelligent enough for the effects of the tongues spell, which is awkward.

:confused:
 

mrpopstar

Sparkly Dude
I did the deed: "@JeremyECrawford If I cast tongues on an ape, does it gain the ability to both understand and speak? #dnd"

:cool:
 

It really isn't vague here. Both parts of the spell (speaking and understanding) refer to a language.

Page 9 of the MM says:

A "―" indicates that a creature neither speaks nor understands any language.

The stat block for apes has this line:

Languages: ―

It really is that simple. The spell won't work on an anything with that line.

That being said, you can always go with a rule of cool, but if you are asking for the RAW, that's it.
 


mrpopstar

Sparkly Dude
It really isn't vague here. Both parts of the spell (speaking and understanding) refer to a language.

Page 9 of the MM says:

A "―" indicates that a creature neither speaks nor understands any language.

The stat block for apes has this line:

Languages: ―

It really is that simple. The spell won't work on an anything with that line.
We agree, but I acknowledge the vagary that arises when a creature that neither speaks nor understands any language is targeted by a spell that grants the ability to understand any spoken language it hears.
 

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