D&D 5E Teleport /fly /misty step the bane of cool dungeon design is RAW in 5E

[Hussar]

It's always funny where people's sticking points are. Me, I have zero problem with the idea of a paladin in leather armor. Doesn't faze me in the least. "Knight in heavy armor" is something I've wanted decoupled from paladins for a very long time.

OTOH, I'm not fond of the teleporting paladin. It just seems so out of place. Then again, I LOATHE the watering down of class spell lists. Druids and clerics dropping Fireballs and invisibility. It's funny, everyone and their mother yoinks stuff that was traditionally wizard only, yet, the notion of wizards gaining healing spells is a bridge too far.

Like I said, everyone has their own line in the sand. Mine is Portapaladins. For others, it's a wizard with any healing ability. I'm sure there are others that don't like druids getting fireball and invisibility.

I would not mind if they backed off, just a smidge, on porting spells between classes.

 

[Immoralkickass]

What's wrong with teleporting paladins? People always complain that paladins do nothing with their spell slots but smite all the time. But when they use it for some mobility its somehow wrong?

 

[The Crimson Binome]

What's wrong with teleporting paladins? People always complain that paladins do nothing with their spell slots but smite all the time. But when they use it for some mobility its somehow wrong?

Divine magic is supposed to be subtle and effects-oriented. Teleportation is really flashy, which is why it traditionally belongs to arcane casters.

 

[Yaarel]

Divine magic is supposed to be subtle and effects-oriented. Teleportation is really flashy, which is why it traditionally belongs to arcane casters.

Divine magic seems inherently planar magic. If any thing should be traveling across the planes, it might as well be Divine magic. (Even healing and radiant energy are the Positive Plane.)

Arcane works fine with Teleporting, Gate, Plane Shift, and so on, but I see little reason to prevent Divine magic from doing the same things.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

Divine magic seems inherently planar magic. If any thing should be traveling across the planes, it might as well be Divine magic. (Even healing and radiant energy are the Positive Plane.)

Arcane works fine with Teleporting, Gate, Plane Shift, and so on, but I see little reason to prevent Divine magic from doing the same things.

When a priest casts a spell, there should be some doubt as to whether there was any magical involved, or whether it was just a coincidence. When a priest cures a disease, it could be that they were channeling the magic of their deity, or it could be just a coincidence that they happened to get better. When a druid empowers some berries to provide nourishment, it could just be psycho-somatic. The same is true of calling a swarm of insects, or creating an earthquake. Even when they raise the dead, there's the chance that they weren't really dead after all. If you have faith, then you believe that it's magic, but there's always room for doubt.

Arcane magic is obviously magic. If someone creates a glowing bead which explodes into a huge fireball after it flies through the air, there's no faith required. Likewise when someone starts flying, or spontaneously grows to twice their normal size. That's definitely magic going on.

At least, that was a traditional distinction. It stopped holding true at about the point where clerics started shooting lasers from their hands, but it still explains why a teleporting paladin feels wrong to a lot of people.

 

[Immoralkickass]

Divine magic is supposed to be subtle and effects-oriented. Teleportation is really flashy, which is why it traditionally belongs to arcane casters.

Teleportation is really flashy? That is exactly why it belongs on the paladin, because they are the flashiest people in D&D. All that silver and gold armour, polished and shinny, with their Sacred Weapon, Holy Nimbus and Smites that deal RADIANT damage.... pass me the shades please.

 

[Hussar]

Teleportation is really flashy? That is exactly why it belongs on the paladin, because they are the flashiest people in D&D. All that silver and gold armour, polished and shinny, with their Sacred Weapon, Holy Nimbus and Smites that deal RADIANT damage.... pass me the shades please.

Well, compare the 2nd level Paladin spells that all paladins get:

Aid
Branding Smite
Find Steed
Lesser Restoration
Locate Object
Magic Weapon
Protection from Poison
Zone of Truth

and then some paladins get Misty Step. One of these things is not like the others... Hrm, healing, smiting, finding the truth, and ... short range teleporting.

 

[Yaarel]

On the Paladin spell list, Find Steed is a planar teleportation spell.

 

[Yama Dai O]

On the Paladin spell list, Find Steed is a planar teleportation spell.

Find Steed, along with Find Familiar, is kind of strange in that it explicitly summons a 'spirit' that mimics the form of an animal, where earlier editions had a similar mechanism that actually got you the flesh-and-blood animal.

Without judging, the 5e take on 'pets' seems very video gamey, designed to make them as much as a non-hassle as they possibly could, to the point that the spell effect is so bland it invites everyone to ignore it. (Q: But where does the Paladin's steed go when we enter the dungeon? A: Away.)

 

[Hussar]

On the Paladin spell list, Find Steed is a planar teleportation spell.

What?

You realize the 5e doesn't have pokemounts anymore right? I'm actually a bit curious. Since the steed is a spirit, what happens to any stuff you put on the steed when it disappears?

Even if we buy that one, and I don't, the only actual planar spell on the paladin's spell list is Banishment. Now, that one I don't have a huge problem with. Makes sense that our paladin can force extra-planar enemies back to their own planes. It's a cleric spell and being able to turn demons and whatnot has always been a thing that paladins (albeit REALLY high level ones) could do.

But, funnily enough, the only transportation spell common to all paladins is the Find Steed spell and, well, the paladin having a mount gets a pass simply for it's level of sacred cowness.

However, a full on teleport (albeit a short range one)? That's something paladins have never had. Even a 4e paladin didn't have that, although, to be fair, the Avenger did have something like that. To me, it just really, really stands out. Clerics don't even get it. Not even as a Domain spell. It's just such a weird thing for paladins to have.