D&D (2024) Interested in new dragon designs for 5e (5.5e or 6e)?

[Yaarel]

These plane types refer to the planar origin of a creature:
• Aberrations (Far Realm)
• Celestials
• Elementals
• Fiends (Infernal)
• Fey (Feywild)
• Undead (Shadowfell)

The Construct type is awkward, but relates to being made artificially out of the ‘stuff’ of the planar origin:
• Constructs

These form types refer to the form of a creature:
• Beasts
• Dragons
• Giants
• Humanoids
• Monstrosities
• Oozes
• Plants



So there are plane types and form types.

The list of plane types remains incomplete.

The Astral Plane is missing from the list of plane types. Also, the Neutral Planes (LE, N, CN) that are neither Celestial (Good) nor Infernal (Evil), are absent from the list.

I view the Great Wheel as parts of the Astral Plane whose nature is an alignment. The rest of the Astral Plane is unaligned. The Celestial Planes are aligned with Good, and the Infernal planes are aligned with Evil, but perhaps what really makes them distinct from the rest of the Astral Plane is their connection to the Positive Plane or the Negative Plane, respectively.

So, ‘Astrals’ is missing from the list of plane types, and it can also cover the Neutral Planes.

‘Ethereals’ is missing from the list. I view Feywild and Shadowfell as aspects of the Ethereal plane. What makes them distinct from the rest of the Ethereal is their connection to the Positive Plane or the Negative Plane, respectively.



The list of the form types seems to represent the Material Plane. Inferably, if a Material creature became entirely otherworldly, thus no longer persisted as an aspect of the Material Plane, then the Material form would cease to be a ‘fundamental nature’ of the creature.

This potential loss of a form type relates to why the Eladrin is either Humanoid or Fey, but not both. If Eladrin are Fey, then they are utterly otherworldly and unable to relate to humans. In other words, Eladrin who are Fey have no soul. Those Eladrin who are Humanoid have somehow gained a human-like soul.

Likewise, celestials and fiends lack souls. The souls of the dead who enter the celestial or infernal, probably need to remain ‘humanoid’, rather than becoming a celestial or a fiend.

 

[Son of the Serpent]

That is basically what he said, of course the MM clearly indicates these are “tags” and that a monster can have one or more tags, so it is not just race. Off the top of my head there are the following tags:
Elf, human, devil, demon, orc.
I would assume all the “races” would be tags. Any others?

But would that make it a subtype or just an independant tag that is classified differently than a subtype per se?

 

[Son of the Serpent]

I did more reading and i get it now. Nevermind.

Some races just happen to be considered an entire subtype. Which is odd. Because subtype implies a level of broadness i would generally not associate with a race. But whatever i guess. It is what it is.

 

[Son of the Serpent]

All races seem to be tags, but all tags are not races. The best example is the 'titan' tag, which is clearly not a race.

To be fair though there is an enture race called titans though that are part of that category.

 

[dave2008]

To be fair though there is an enture race called titans though that are part of that category.

Not in 5e. 5e Titans: empyrean (classic D&D titan), krakens, and tarrasqe. I’m sure there may be others as well. I think that atropal from TOA is also listed as a titan. But I could be wrong.

 

[Laurefindel]

So, in general, I really liked the Lockwood dragons when they first came out. But after being stuck with them for 3 editions I think they are a bit long in the tooth. In fact, I find most of the chromatic dragons that aren’t red a bit boring or annoying in some way or the other.

Now I realize WotC is not going to redesign the dragons midway into and edit on; however, with the rumors of dragonlance coming down the pipe, I can but wonder if we could get new designs, just like DL did back in the day.

So is that something others would be interested in? If so, what would you change, while keeping the iconic color schemes and breath weapons? What should stay and what should go?

I'd be all in favour of a dragon redesign.

But as I was re-reading my reply before posting, I realised that very few changes I'd like to see would have no mechanical consequences. In other words, I see most cosmetic changes as a form of specialisation (beyond the type of breathe weapon) that would be nice to represent mechanically as well (black dragon horns, blue dragon spiked tail etc)

The only major cosmetic change I would like without mechanical consequences is 4-limbs dragons, but that too is going against the iconic identity of D&D dragons.

 

[Son of the Serpent]

Not in 5e. 5e Titans: empyrean (classic D&D titan), krakens, and tarrasqe. I’m sure there may be others as well. I think that atropal from TOA is also listed as a titan. But I could be wrong.

Ah. Thankyou.

 

[dave2008]

Ah. Thankyou.

There is a description of Titans in the DMG as well. They are listed along with quasi-deities demigods and lesser and greater guards As a group of cosmic beings. I believe there Are creatures that have some bit of the divine spark By the creation of this gods or some other means

 

[dave2008]

I'd be all in favour of a dragon redesign.

But as I was re-reading my reply before posting, I realised that very few changes I'd like to see would have no mechanical consequences. In other words, I see most cosmetic changes as a form of specialisation (beyond the type of breathe weapon) that would be nice to represent mechanically as well (black dragon horns, blue dragon spiked tail etc)

The only major cosmetic change I would like without mechanical consequences is 4-limbs dragons, but that too is going against the iconic identity of D&D dragons.

I do want to clarify that I’m not saying there can’t be mechanical changes to the dragons. I’m just saying that’s not what I wanted to discuss in this thread. I would assume any redesign would also include mechanical revisions to accommodate those re-designs. But that is another discussion.

 

[Yaarel]

It is surprising that even the Half-Dragon has nothing in its stat block to indicate that it is dragon. This creature can be humanoid, beast, monstrosity, and giant. But not dragon. Again, the 5e-ism, there can only be one type possible. And even in a case of two parents, only one of them can apply.