D&D 5E Tactical Combat Module, hasn't it always been there?

[Don Durito]

The best thing released for increasing tactics to date was Greyhawk initiative. That was a bit of a revelation for me - seeing (and remembering) how putzing around with initiative can transform the tactical game without the need to fuss around with complicated class powers.

Except it didn't work very well with 5E's extremely overbusy class design. No matter. I think I'll steal it for Castles and Crusades where it should work much better.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

I'm still trying to find the actual promise you were referring to...

When threads devolve into posting definition of words they get shut down so I will say this instead.

A promise as viewed in a court of law is not the definition of promise that I am using. If you don't think that WotC promised something in what I posed then that is your opinion. I believe that they did promise something in what I was posting and that is my opinion.

Our opinion do not seem to have common ground on this subject.

 

[Imaro]

When threads devolve into posting definition of words they get shut down so I will say this instead.

A promise as viewed in a court of law is not the definition of promise that I am using. If you don't think that WotC promised something in what I posed then that is your opinion. I believe that they did promise something in what I was posting and that is my opinion.

Our opinion do not seem to have common ground on this subject.

I think a "promise" is pretty clear cut, but yes if you are using your own definition of a word, one I'm not sure the developers and designers are necessarily using, then we probably don't have any common ground around this.

 

[JiffyPopTart]

They promised tactical not to rewrite the game duplicating whatever.

I will reiterate what was said in my post above.

To quote Mearls "Some advanced rules go back and change a key element of the core system in a fundamental way. With these rules, we expect that everyone at the table will have to revise their characters in some way to account for the new law of physics, such as it is, that a DM is using. For instance, armor as DR, hit locations, and a variant approach to magic fall into this category. "

If you do not believe that the above statement does not include "rewrite the game" in various ways then our opinions differ on what we are/were expecting from the idea of modules.

 

[Zardnaar]

I think they delivered in what they were talking about but people's expectations weren't met.

This is basically what I was talking about in 2013 when it was mentioned.

They won't do much about classes, at best you would get some splatbook like 2E combat and tactics.

For some reason I think some people thought they would get variant classes which wasn't gonna happen.

 

[Zardnaar]

I will reiterate what was said in my post above.

To quote Mearls "Some advanced rules go back and change a key element of the core system in a fundamental way. With these rules, we expect that everyone at the table will have to revise their characters in some way to account for the new law of physics, such as it is, that a DM is using. For instance, armor as DR, hit locations, and a variant approach to magic fall into this category. "

If you do not believe that the above statement does not include "rewrite the game" in various ways then our opinions differ on what we are/were expecting from the idea of modules.

And what they delivered meets that criteria. If you read more into that's on you not them.

Passed on basic logic like page count for starters at best you would get a single book like UA 3.5 or Combat and Tactics second Ed.

We still might get such a book as they're working on variant class features.

We were using tactics back in 2E but some edition warriors got it into their heads 4E invented the concept and then further thought class based powers was the only expression of it.

They have rules for weapon speeds, flanking, grids etc. That's tactical. It may not be what you want but it's there.

 

[Weiley31]

I like/use the Cleaving Through Creatures(I allow it to affect damaged enemies as well), Hero Points, Epic Boons, Feats, and Players Rewarding Inspiration.

 

[Teemu]

I’ve tried the Marking variant.

Awful. Fiddly. Poorly thought out. You thought 4e marking was cumbersome? Let’s add a more complex version to every single combatant.

 

[tetrasodium]

Most of the modularity in the DMG breaks down if you actually try to use it.

It's simply not ready out of the box. You need to use it, see how things affect other things, houserule, reiterate, try again.

Flanking for example, if it gives advantage, is vastly more powerful than in previous editions of D&D and if used severely reduced the value of class powers that give opportunities to gain advantage.

The ironic rage inducing side effect is that it and a lot of it could probably have been trivially implemented in reverse to go from more complex base to streamlined & maybe at times overly simplified like we have in default 5e had the variant stuff in the dmg been implemented with the needed base structure & foundational elements needed for it to work. It's easy to simplify something complex, but to go in reverse takes a lot more work to avoid making a mess

Doing that would have allowed space in the dmg for both that simplified style as well as variant rules that are both interesting & capable of actually working without disrupting game balance or requiting massive construction adding missing support structures.

 

[Garthanos]

The ironic rage inducing side effect is that it and a lot of it could probably have been trivially implemented in reverse to go from more complex base to streamlined & maybe at times overly simplified like we have in default 5e had the variant stuff in the dmg been implemented with the needed base structure & foundational elements needed for it to work. It's easy to simplify something complex, but to go in reverse takes a lot more work to avoid making a mess

Doing that would have allowed space in the dmg for both that simplified style as well as variant rules that are both interesting & capable of actually working without disrupting game balance or requiting massive construction adding missing support structures.

Build AD&D concurrent with D&D but release D&D with all the handles in place to use with Advanced Rules.