D&D 5E What To Do With Racial ASIs?

[Parmandur]

Also, like... I don’t think the “most of them were probably test builds” argument really helps the case against most players not using Feats. 5e is not so complex that a test build is necessary if you aren't planning to use Feats. I would imagine, then, that most test builds would have them.

Exactly! Honestly, I'm not that big on digital tools for 5E because I both like analog, and it's not rocket surgery to build a PC in this edition. But if one had paid for all the tools and was just experimenting, doing funny things with Feats would seem to be a high priority.

 

[FrogReaver]

That's bordering on paranoid.

Also, Every non variant human character level 1-3 doesn’t use feats.

Characters using feats is highly impacted by character level. The number of players and games allowing feats and interested in them is much higher than d&d beyond data predicts due to the higher number of lower level PCs and the system not allowing many feat choices with the base package.

All beyond data is showing us is that feats aren’t the most popular option for lower level PCs. I think we all could have predicted that.

 

[Parmandur]

Also, Every non variant human character level 1-3 doesn’t use feats.

And most people who've bought all the relevant material, and then make Human Characters, still use the standard Human option. It's not just an SRD issue, the standard Human is legitimately one of the most popular options.

 

[FrogReaver]

And most people who've bought all the relevant material, and then make Human Characters, still use the standard Human option. It's not just an SRD issue, the standard Human is legitimately one of the most popular options.

Got some numbers for that?

 

[Parmandur]

Got some numbers for that?

Sure. Way more than 4% of 1-3 PCs are Human:

Here Are The Most Popular D&D Feats (War Caster Leads The Pack!)

It's time for some more D&D Beyond stats! This time we take a look at the most popular feats! War Caster, Tough, Lucky, and Sharpshooter lead the pack. We recently looked at stats for adventures, classes by tier, subclasses, and multi class combinations. The last time DDB looked at this, the...

www.enworld.org

 

[Charlaquin]

Also, Every non variant human character level 1-3 doesn’t use feats.

Characters using feats is highly impacted by character level. The number of players and games allowing feats and interested in them is much higher than d&d beyond data predicts due to the higher number of lower level PCs and the system not allowing many feat choices with the base package.

All beyond data is showing us is that feats aren’t the most popular option for lower level PCs. I think we all could have predicted that.

My suspicion - and I have no data to back this up, but it would fit with my anecdotal experience - is that most groups probably do allow Feats, but most players don’t use them. This is likely due to a wide variety of factors, including level, and the general utility of an ASI over most Feats. I’ve seen enough people who like Feats and want them to be on the table but prefer to hold off on taking any until they get their primary score up to 20, and enough campaigns end before 12th level to believe that even if Feats being allowed was the default, most characters still wouldn’t take any in their careers.

 

[cbwjm]

My suspicion - and I have no data to back this up, but it would fit with my anecdotal experience - is that most groups probably do allow Feats, but most players don’t use them. This is likely due to a wide variety of factors, including level, and the general utility of an ASI over most Feats. I’ve seen enough people who like Feats and want them to be on the table but prefer to hold off on taking any until they get their primary score up to 20, and enough campaigns end before 12th level to believe that even if Feats being allowed was the default, most characters still wouldn’t take any in their careers.

I've often thought the same thing. I would not be surprised if many players rush for that 20 in their main attack stat so unless they start with an odd number and pick up a half feat for an additional +1 then they are, more often than not, going to boost their stat with the standard +2. I know for me it is very rare that a feat will complete a character I'm making to the point where I'll pick it up as soon as I have the opportunity.

 

[Maxperson]

Maxperson is using the common rhetorical trick of stating a truth that is fairly accepted - in this case don’t trust everything a corporate spokesperson says at face value - and then extrapolating it to a specific incidence - in this case the statements by WoTC and D&D Beyond (fandom.com) - and saying that a = b.

This is obviously incorrect.

Eh, not even close. I said that I don't take corporate spokespeople at face value. Me. You can take them at face value if you want.

The logical basis he derives as proof is the some people at WoTC have an agenda against feats because they add bloat. This is an assumption of intent without basis in fact. The general rule that mods seem to have here is that you should take people posting in good faith unless there is proof they are operating otherwise.

This is false. I didn't give that as any sort of proof of what I was saying. Someone here asked what POSSIBLE reason could there be, so I supplied a POSSIBLE reason.

He further tries to discredit the D&D Beyond data by using the SRD only approach when DMs can share their books with players (12 or more) and many people buy at least the PHB on D&D Beyond (really cheap with the coupon from the Essentials Set, for example).

I didn't try to discredit them. I did discredit them. This claim of yours that all people have access to DMs books when we all know that lots of people go there by themselves to test out builds is bupkis. The site designed the base program to have no feats. Having Grappler as their one and only feet is the equivalent to having no feats when it comes to building PCs.

He finally threatens to report to the mods people that laugh at his logic train when a very valid assumption is that he is trying to be funny.

Nope. When they deliberately mock with the laugh feature.

 

[Maxperson]

They have over the past couple years released stats for various buckets, including stats for all-in users. People who have literally paid for everything still favor the basic Subclass options, non-variant Humans, and don't use Feats.

Can you link that?

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Also, Every non variant human character level 1-3 doesn’t use feats.

Characters using feats is highly impacted by character level. The number of players and games allowing feats and interested in them is much higher than d&d beyond data predicts due to the higher number of lower level PCs and the system not allowing many feat choices with the base package.

All beyond data is showing us is that feats aren’t the most popular option for lower level PCs. I think we all could have predicted that.

This is just absurd. It's tiring watching some of y'all jump through every possible hoop to avoid accepting a fact that doesn't remotely affect you.

Feats aren't that popular.

Can you link that?

Parmandur is a more patient person than many of us, and probably will, but dude. Seriously?

You know damn well how to google things.