Level Up (A5E) Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition Is Coming!

Zaukrie · Aug 10, 2020

Haldrik said:
I agree. A stand-alone allows more freedom for the design.

Right, a stand-alone can really offer choices at every level.

EzekielRaiden · Aug 10, 2020

Garthanos said:
I feel a lot of things including Warlord/Magicless Ranger/4e style Defender(more interesting than the cavalier) can be better achieved by improving the fighter/rogue flexibility.

You may be surprised to hear that "your preference gets demoted to being a side-load addendum to someone else's preference" is distinctly unpopular among fans of Warlords, Defenders, and generally crunchy 4e-style combat/mechanics.

Haldrik · Aug 10, 2020

EzekielRaiden said:
You may be surprised to hear that "your preference gets demoted to being a side-load addendum to someone else's preference" is distinctly unpopular among fans of Warlords, Defenders, and generally crunchy 4e-style combat/mechanics.

Historically, Garthanos is a prominent Warlord fan. I would look twice at any preferences he suggest.

I am surprised, he feels that a Fighter or Rogue class is workable for certain Warlord concepts.

Haldrik · Aug 10, 2020

I want a Knight class − for a formerly trained heavy-armored warrior, with Intelligence tactics and history and Charisma morale and politics. This is essentially the smart warrior.

Subclass archetypes for the Knight class can be:
• nonmagic: Inspirer Warlord (healing while nonzero), Tactician Warlord (lazylording), Cavalier, Samurai, Shielder bodyguard, etcetera
• magic: Paladin of various oaths, Eldritch Knight, Warden, a psionic with force armor, etcetera

polyhedral man · Aug 10, 2020

Zaukrie said:
How many do you want? I have a draft PDF with over fifty.....want to read it and offer your opinions? Some are good, some I would never use but I built them anyway.

Yes, i'd be interested in taking a look, thanks for the offer. One question - what was the incentive for writing something you wouldn't use? Unless it was part of your process.

doctorbadwolf · Aug 10, 2020

Haldrik said:
Historically, Garthanos is a prominent Warlord fan. I would look twice at any preferences he suggest.

I am surprised, he feels that a Fighter or Rogue class is workable for certain Warlord concepts.

Garth and I have gone back and forth with ideas for a fighter warlord quite a bit.

We disagree on how many widgets it needs, but I like his ideas in general.

The main thing to me is to take each major fighter feature and make it soemthing they can use to boost an ally. Extra attack becomes Heroic Action, and gains the ability to let an ally attack as a reaction at the cost of the fighter’s attack.

Action Surge becomes “let someone else take an extra action on their next turn”.

Second Wind becomes Inspiring Word, and an ally gets HP equal to 1d10+your fighter level.

Indomitable becomes Bulwark and applies to an ally.

etc.

Then the crunch maeisters like me and Garth take Battlemaster or a new leader focused subclass.

polyhedral man · Aug 10, 2020

Morrus said:
We're only writing one game.

Fair point. To explain my thinking:
After:

reading 13th Age, particularly the escalation die mechanic
playing 5th
reading about Balsera-Style and Greyhawk initiative
planning a campaign for a single player, and two players

i thought that it would be cool if you had two or three initiative systems in the same game. To represent different states of escalation/momentum/synergy between the players.

And then certain actions, combinations of actions or mini goals, could alter the initiative system. If done right it could simulate the "we're up against it" vs "we're gathering momentum and going to town" feeling.

doctorbadwolf · Aug 11, 2020

If you plan to have the “martial” classes have options for magic just like in standard 5e, I recommend figuring out a resource pool or recharge system for the base class that is as simple as possible from the start, so that mundane manuever widgets, and magical manuever widgets, can live in the same class more easily than they do in standard D&D 5e.

Tales and Chronicles · Aug 11, 2020

doctorbadwolf said:
If you plan to have the “martial” classes have options for magic just like in standard 5e, I recommend figuring out a resource pool or recharge system for the base class that is as simple as possible from the start, so that mundane manuever widgets, and magical manuever widgets, can live in the same class more easily than they do in standard D&D 5e.

I think spell-like maneuvers, like the Arcane Archer shots and the 4E special powers would be ideal instead of 1/3 spellcasters that never seems to get enough spells to really matters instead of spamming shield/absord elements/shadow blade...

In my own fantasy heartbreaker 5e, I refluffed the BM's maneuver as Hexes used by the Warlock instead of spells.

Warlock’s Essences

Fumbling hex: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one superiority die to attempt to disarm the target, forcing it to drop one item of your choice that it's holding. You add the essence die to the attack's damage roll, and the target must make a STR save. On a failed save, it drops the object you choose. The object lands 15 ft away from it.

Disorienting hex: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to distract the creature, giving your allies an opening. You add the essence die to the attack's damage roll. The next attack roll against the target by an attacker other than you has advantage if the attack is made before the start of your next turn.

Shadow walk: When you move, you can expend one essence die, rolling the die and adding the number rolled to your AC until you stop moving.

Hex of fury: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to attempt to goad the target into attacking you. You add the essence die to the attack’s damage roll, and the target must make a WIS save. On a failed save, the target has disadvantage on all attack rolls against targets other than you until the end of your next turn.

Eldritch spear: When you make an attack against a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to increase your reach for that attack by 15 ft. If you hit, you add the essence die to the cantriattack’s damage roll.

Frightening hex: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to attempt to frighten the target. You add the essence die to the attack’s damage roll, and the target must make a WIS save. On a failed save, it is frightened of you until the end of your next turn.

Eldritch aim: When you make a spell attack roll with a cantrip against a creature, you can expend one essence die to add it to the roll. You can use this essence before or after making the attack roll, but before any effects of the attack are applied.

Repelling blast: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to attempt to drive the target back. You add the essence die to the attack’s damage roll, and if the target is Large or smaller, it must make a STR save. On a failed save, you push the target up to 15 feet away from you.

Draining hex. When you hit a creature with with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can use a bonus action and expend one essence die to cure of one of your ally. When you do so, choose a friendly creature who can see or hear you. That creature gains temporary hit points equal to the essence die roll + your Charisma modifier.

Vengeful rebuke: When a creature misses you with a melee attack, you can use your reaction and expend one essence die to make a melee weapon attack against the creature. If you hit, you add the superiority die to the attack's damage roll.

Eldritch burst: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to attempt to damage another creature with the same action. All creatures of your choice within 5 feet of the original target and within your reach; it takes damage equal to the number you roll on your essence die. The damage is of the same type dealt by the original attack.

Sapping hex: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die to attempt to knock the target down. You add the essence die to the attack's damage roll, and if the target is Large or smaller, it must make a STR save. On a failed save, you knock the target prone.

Darkfire step: When you make a Dexterity (Stealth) check or an initiative roll, you can expend one superiority die and add the die to the roll.

Monstrous grasp: When you hit a creature with a weapon attack with your hexed blade, you can expend one essence die and use a bonus action to grapple the target at distance. Add the superiority die to your Strength (Athletics) check. The target is also restrained while grappled in this way.

Beguiling tongue: When you make a Charisma (Deception) check or a Charisma (Persuasion) check, you can expend one essence die, and add the result to the ability check.

Eldritch sight: When you make a Wisdom (Insight) check or an Intelligence (Investigation) check, you can expend one essence die, and add the result to the ability check.

In the end, it kinda works. Now, this is just an example with already made maneuvers with a new coat of paint, but the idea still as its charm.

Charlaquin · Aug 11, 2020

EzekielRaiden said:
You may be surprised to hear that "your preference gets demoted to being a side-load addendum to someone else's preference" is distinctly unpopular among fans of Warlords, Defenders, and generally crunchy 4e-style combat/mechanics.

Hey! Nice job articulating my feelings on the “nonmagical ranger is redundant” argument!