D&D 5E Mythic Odysseys of Theros

[Parmandur]

The Love/Unity cleric and the starry druid where probably aimed at Theros, and therefore are probably dead.

Actually, the Star Druid is one of the options Crawford let drip had made it into a future product, and was part of the 2020 tests. The September-October tests last year were probably all for Theros, though, two made it into the book, two were revisited in tests, and the other 8 are probably DOA.

 

[dave2008]

I'd love more mythic monsters. Fo you know what book on DMs Guild has them? I always have a terrible finding anything on there that's not super popular.

Mythic Encounters

 

[dave2008]

So you just don’t let the cantrip (spesfic not general) Work as written.

I let the Mythic Trait work as written. It is clear the intent of mythic design is for the mythic monster to act as two monsters (thus the XP is doubled). There are things implied by this intent that I don't need written down (but others might), such as:

1. The monster regains all HP
2. All conditions on the monster end (this would apply to Chill touch)
3. All abilities recharge.

I don't need it written out, the implication of the design intent is enough for me. This says it all:

"Fighting Arasta as a mythic encounter is equivalent to taking on two challenge rating 21 creatures in one encounter. Award a party 66,000 XP for defeating Arasta after she uses Armor of Spiders."

 

[DnD Warlord]

I let the Mythic Trait work as written. It is clear the intent of mythic design is for the mythic monster to act as two monsters (thus the XP is doubled). There are things implied by this intent that I don't need written down (but others might), such as:

1. The monster regains all HP
2. All conditions on the monster end (this would apply to Chill touch)
3. All abilities recharge.

I don't need it written out, the implication of the design intent is enough for me. This says it all:

"Fighting Arasta as a mythic encounter is equivalent to taking on two challenge rating 21 creatures in one encounter. Award a party 66,000 XP for defeating Arasta after she uses Armor of Spiders."

We will have to disagree. It says that they regain hp.:. If a PC stops it from regaining hp I see no way to not just end the fight.

 

[dave2008]

We will have to disagree. It says that they regain hp.:. If a PC stops it from regaining hp I see no way to not just end the fight.

Are you speaking as a player or a DM? Do you understand that the purpose of the DM is to adjudicate? Do you understand the design intent of the Mythic Monsters as described in the part I quoted above?

If the DM wants this to be a mythic monster, the mythic trait must activate - otherwise it is not a mythic monster (and you don't get the XP). The choice of using this as a mythic monster is up to the DM. If the DM makes that choice, the mythic trait must activate - nothing the PCs can do about. Again from Astra:

"Arasta as a Mythic Encounter
Arasta is a formidable enemy under normal circumstances, but to give characters a truly mythic challenge, you can have her call on her Armor of Spiders. Her use of this trait signals a drastic turn in the encounter, as Arasta summons her arachnid children to protect her. While she has temporary hit points from this trait, she can choose one of her mythic actions when she uses a legendary action."

It is the choice by the DM to give it the mythic trait - that overrides chill touch or anything else really. It is really pretty clear.

 

[DnD Warlord]

Are you speaking as a player or a DM? Do you understand that the purpose of the DM is to adjudicate? Do you understand the design intent of the Mythic Monsters as described in the part I quoted above?

If the DM wants this to be a mythic monster, the mythic trait must activate - otherwise it is not a mythic monster (and you don't get the XP). The choice of using this as a mythic monster is up to the DM. If the DM makes that choice, the mythic trait must activate - nothing the PCs can do about. Again from Astra:

"Arasta as a Mythic Encounter
Arasta is a formidable enemy under normal circumstances, but to give characters a truly mythic challenge, you can have her call on her Armor of Spiders. Her use of this trait signals a drastic turn in the encounter, as Arasta summons her arachnid children to protect her. While she has temporary hit points from this trait, she can choose one of her mythic actions when she uses a legendary action."

It is the choice by the DM to give it the mythic trait - that overrides chill touch or anything else really. It is really pretty clear.

Both. I DM weekly and have since about 2000, but even before that I had lots of 2e games I ran... right now we’ll still in lock down I am playing in 1 bi weekly Roll20 campaign but at begging of year I was running 2 games a week and playing every week...

I CAN as a DM (and do quite often) make up what ever rules I want to make the game fun...but that doesn’t help or hurt rules we all paid for a professional to write.

 

[dave2008]

Both. I DM weekly and have since about 2000, but even before that I had lots of 2e games I ran... right now we’ll still in lock down I am playing in 1 bi weekly Roll20 campaign but at begging of year I was running 2 games a week and playing every week...

I CAN as a DM (and do quite often) make up what ever rules I want to make the game fun...but that doesn’t help or hurt rules we all paid for a professional to write.

IDK, seems like you are trying not to see the very rules I posted for you about mythic monsters. It is very clear the mythic trait is DM triggered and that it is supposed to be worth 2 monsters. None of that is possible if I interpret the interaction of the mythic trait and chill touch as you do.

EDIT: To be clear, they could have said: "All conditions and effects on Arasta end when her mythic trait is activated." That would have clarified things, but I am confident that was the intent and personally don't need it do be stated as such.

 

[DnD Warlord]

IDK, seems like you are trying not to see the very rules I posted for you about mythic monsters. It is very clear the mythic trait is DM triggered and that it is supposed to be worth 2 monsters. None of that is possible if I interpret the interaction of the mythic trait and chill touch as you do.

EDIT: To be clear, they could have said: "All conditions and effects on Arasta end when her mythic trait is activated." That would have clarified things, but I am confident that was the intent and personally don't need it do be stated as such.

This is where we disagree I do not know the intent beyond what has been written and talked about... please tell me did you talk to a writer to find out this intent, or just make it up?

Also do you rule Chill Touch does not stop the regen of Trolls, since we can guess the intent is to make trolls hard to kill without fire and acid...

 

[dave2008]

This is where we disagree I do not know the intent beyond what has been written and talked about... please tell me did you talk to a writer to find out this intent, or just make it up?

Listen we disagree and that is ok. I have not spoken to a writer, but I don't need to. It is clear, to me, it is written in the book. I will make on last post about this, just to help you out. From MOoT:

"Mythic Monsters
This section describes three of Theros’s most infamous terrors, beings whose might and dreadful deeds set them apart as menaces of legendary proportions. While many of Theros’s greatest myths arise from storied terrors—like the hydra Polukranos or the dreaded titans—the monsters in this section have a feature that sets them apart: mythic traits.

Mythic traits transform battles into truly legendary confrontations, well suited to the climactic battles at the ends of adventures or whole campaigns. Mythic traits are optional; they don’t need to be used during combat with these monsters. If you so choose, you may simply ignore a monster’s mythic trait and mythic actions. If you wish to increase a battle’s stakes, though, using a monster’s mythic trait results in some mid-battle twist that changes the way the monster behaves, restores its resources, or provides it with new actions to use. As a result, the battle becomes deadlier and rages on for longer than most combat encounters. Each monster features an “As a Mythic Encounter” section that highlights its mythic trait, notes how using it changes the difficulty of the encounter and the rewards, and includes read-aloud text you can use mid-battle to signal a terrifying shift in the conflict. "

From this passage a few things are clear to me:

• Mythic traits are special and specific (specific beats general). These are features specific and unique to mythic monsters, it "sets them apart."
• Additionally, the trait restores resources, among other things, with the intent of...
• The traits are intended to make the battle "deadlier" and "longer."

I don't need to guess the intent - it is right there in writting.

Additionally, each monster gets an "...as a Mythic Encounter" section in its monster entry. Here is Hythonia's:

"Hythonia as a Mythic Encounter
Hythonia serves as a potent threat against even high-level characters, but you can increase the challenge by using the Shed Skin trait. When this happens, Hythonia heals many of her wounds and slips away from danger, and then she can choose one of her mythic actions when she uses a legendary action."
...
Fighting Hythonia as a mythic encounter is equivalent to taking on two challenge rating 17 creatures in one encounter. Award a party 36,000 XP for defeating Hythonia after she uses Shed Skin."

From this text is clear that:

• The mythic trait is intended to "increase the challenge."
• Hythonia recovers from damage: "heals her wounds."
• The intent is that it is "equivalent" to two CR 17 monsters. And worth 2x the XP.

Again, I don't need to guess the intent, it is right there in the rules of the book in black and white. So I ask you: how would you adjudicate chill touch when the mythic trait specifically tells you Hythonia heals her wounds and it increases the challenge of the encounter? Do you really think the intent is unclear or are just arguing that they could have been more explicit?

Also do you rule Chill Touch does not stop the regen of Trolls, since we can guess the intent is to make trolls hard to kill without fire and acid...

I don't rule it at all as none of my PCs have the cantrip. However, I would allow it to negate the trolls regeneration. A troll is not a unique and special monster like mythic monsters are.

 

[teitan]

Sounds like a good question for Twitter.