D&D 5E Capping Hit Points

[Flamestrike]

Punching with a padded glove is a far different situation than being hit by an axe, arrow, or bullet.

IMO the difference between the wizard and the barbarian would be 10-15%, tops. A barbarian would be harder to hit, though.

Thats what HP represent. Dodging ability. And Parry skill. And using armor and shields better than other people. And Skill. And Resolve. And Luck. And the Will to Live. And Heath.

A 1st level Wizard PC with 8 HP who gets 'hit' by a Frost Giants axe and takes 30 damage, is narrated as him zigging when he should have zagged, the axe hitting him square, and being cut in half.

A 20th level Barbarian PC who gets 'hit' by a Frost Giants axe and takes 30 damage, is narrated as leaping out of the way at the last second, as the shock of the 1 tonne axe slams into the ground next to him, coming up in a fighting stance, ready to counterattack.

In your modern game, a 1st level PC with 5 HP who is 'hit' for 30 damage from a machine gun burst is turned into a pink mist as he charges directly into the beaten zone of the MG. The 20th level PC standing right next to him who takes the exact same 'damage' is narrated as leaping into cover at the last second, the bullets landing around him and whizzing overhead, before leopard crawling to a firing position, ready for his next bounding move.

Audie Murphy had 200 Hit points:

The Germans scored a direct hit on an M10 tank destroyer, setting it alight, forcing the crew to abandon it. Murphy ordered his men to retreat to positions in the woods, remaining alone at his post, shooting his M1 carbine and directing artillery fire via his field radio while the Germans aimed fire directly at his position. Murphy mounted the abandoned, burning tank destroyer and began firing its .50 caliber machine gun at the advancing Germans, killing a squad crawling through a ditch towards him. For an hour, Murphy stood on the flaming tank destroyer returning German fire from foot soldiers and advancing tanks, killing or wounding 50 Germans. He sustained a leg wound during his stand, and stopped only after he ran out of ammunition. Murphy rejoined his men, disregarding his own injury, and led them back to repel the Germans.

 

[Jd Smith1]

Thats what HP represent. Dodging ability. And Parry skill. And using armor and shields better than other people. And Skill. And Resolve. And Luck. And the Will to Live. And Heath.

A 1st level Wizard PC with 8 HP who gets 'hit' by a Frost Giants axe and takes 30 damage, is narrated as him zigging when he should have zagged, the axe hitting him square, and being cut in half.

A 20th level Barbarian PC who gets 'hit' by a Frost Giants axe and takes 30 damage, is narrated as leaping out of the way at the last second, as the shock of the 1 tonne axe slams into the ground next to him, coming up in a fighting stance, ready to counterattack.

In your modern game, a 1st level PC with 5 HP who is 'hit' for 30 damage from a machine gun burst is turned into a pink mist as he charges directly into the beaten zone of the MG. The 20th level PC standing right next to him who takes the exact same 'damage' is narrated as leaping into cover at the last second, the bullets landing around him and whizzing overhead, before leopard crawling to a firing position, ready for his next bounding move.

Audie Murphy had 200 Hit points:

Nope.

I spent a long hot vacation examining user-level ballistic theory from both sides of the equation. That is most assuredly not how it works.

 

[dave2008]

Nope.

I spent a long hot vacation examining user-level ballistic theory from both sides of the equation. That is most assuredly not how it works.

Interesting, what did you learn?

 

[Flamestrike]

Nope.

I spent a long hot vacation examining user-level ballistic theory from both sides of the equation. That is most assuredly not how it works.

Good on ya. I spent 10 years in the Army including a stint with Special Forces.

That is how it works.

 

[Scott Christian]

From a conversational point of view, I would add things like magic missile are the same as being hit with a fist. A club can be the same as a shin kicking. And a crossbow that doesn't break chainmail (I know, it can, but if it doesn't) leaves the same bruise as a knee from a two hundred pound person landing on your chest.

It really does depend on many variables: weapon type, armor, dodging or rolling with the blow, and speed of said objects at impact.

I mean is a griffin talon more dangerous than a dagger? And doesn't a dagger plunge do just as much or more damage than a slicing two handed sword? And wouldn't the bite of a dragon kill even the hardiest of adventurers? Heck, the bite of a hippo would kill most adventurers under 10th level. And what about poison. I mean, getting bit by a cobra or black mamba could mean death, even to a 20th level wizard. What if five black mambas, three rattle snakes, and one constrictor who tied up his hands attacked? Pretty sure that amount of poison would kill almost all characters.

 

[Flamestrike]

I mean is a griffin talon more dangerous than a dagger?

Not when the talon hits your shield (inflicting 10 points of 'damage' to your HP).

Remember, 'damage' is damage to your HP (not necessarily to your body), and HP (by RAW) is 'luck, resolve, the will to live and health' and is directly increased by increasing experience and skill (XP and Class).

30 points of 'damage' can be 30 points of Luck lost (with the blow deflecting off your shield instead of actually harming you, or being a Lucky miss).

All down to the narration.

 

[Lanefan]

Yep. Which is why I am forced to settle for abstractions such as hit points.

But we can dream.

I guess one obvious result of implementing a system like you have in mind would be opening up the idea of 'called shots' where an attack is made against a specific part of the body e.g. "I go for his weapon hand" or "I try to take her knees out" - something D&D has never supported despite a few vague wave-at-its in the distant past.

Long ago I tried a simplistic called-shot system in a 1e-like game. It lasted maybe two sessions. Complete mess. I learned that to do it right required, in effect, assigning separate AC values and hit point numbers to each body part; and life is too short for that.

 

[Cadence]

I guess one obvious result of implementing a system like you have in mind would be opening up the idea of 'called shots' where an attack is made against a specific part of the body e.g. "I go for his weapon hand" or "I try to take her knees out" - something D&D has never supported despite a few vague wave-at-its in the distant past.

Long ago I tried a simplistic called-shot system in a 1e-like game. It lasted maybe two sessions. Complete mess. I learned that to do it right required, in effect, assigning separate AC values and hit point numbers to each body part; and life is too short for that.

Is Phoenix Command the game that went into the most detail about all of this? (Made up a character once, never played it).

 

[Scott Christian]

Not when the talon hits your shield (inflicting 10 points of 'damage' to your HP).

Remember, 'damage' is damage to your HP (not necessarily to your body), and HP (by RAW) is 'luck, resolve, the will to live and health' and is directly increased by increasing experience and skill (XP and Class).

30 points of 'damage' can be 30 points of Luck lost (with the blow deflecting off your shield instead of actually harming you, or being a Lucky miss).

All down to the narration.

I Know Flamestrike, and completely agree with your interpretation. It is mine as well. I was responding from a much earlier post where JD who said "flesh is flesh." I think in my initial post I even started it with a statement like - If that is your interpretation.

But I am with you and the narrative definition, and in a sense, was kind of poking fun at it with a bit of hyperbole by talking about magic missile and poison. HP is not a perfect mechanic, but it is a very good one.

As for the initial talk of HP bloat, to actually configure it correctly the only option I see is to write an entirely new ruleset. A different game.

 

[commandercrud]

Somewhere along the way Hit Points stopped meaning Hit Points. Regardless, in 5e those Points are severely bloated.