D&D 5E Polearm Master + quarterstaff...+ shield?

Stupid? Yes. Game breaking? No. Actually I´d allow quite a few more things than RAW. And might disallow others based on game balance. That is called houseruling and totally fine.

Staff and shield is ok.

This might not be very historical, but it can be easily done.

and Zulu stick fighting. With a staff and shield as defensive Item and a club as attacking weapon...

and an extra attack as bonus action does not differ much from an extra attack from extra attack feature... so why not...
 

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Stupid? Yes. Game breaking? No. Actually I´d allow quite a few more things than RAW. And might disallow others based on game balance. That is called houseruling and totally fine.

Staff and shield is ok.

This might not be very historical, but it can be easily done.

and Zulu stick fighting. With a staff and shield as defensive Item and a club as attacking weapon...

and an extra attack as bonus action does not differ much from an extra attack from extra attack feature... so why not...
The first video is a spear. Spears have a that little sharp pointy thing at the end.

The second video the sticks don't qualify as quarterstaves. A quarterstaff is 6-9 ft long or longer. It's a weapon not represented by the rules.

As always, RAW is clear I just think it's dumb.
 

The first video is a spear. Spears have a that little sharp pointy thing at the end.

The second video the sticks don't qualify as quarterstaves. A quarterstaff is 6-9 ft long or longer. It's a weapon not represented by the rules.

As always, RAW is clear I just think it's dumb.
The difference between pointy end to the face and heavy metal or wood to the face is not that severe considering that in DnD the fight does not take bleeding into account. The second one is, as I said, a club and staff with shield in the other hand.
You can say, it is dumb, I thought so too, but in the mean time, it is not more dumb than attacking with a crosswbow 5 times in 6 seconds...
 

The difference between pointy end to the face and heavy metal or wood to the face is not that severe considering that in DnD the fight does not take bleeding into account. The second one is, as I said, a club and staff with shield in the other hand.
You can say, it is dumb, I thought so too, but in the mean time, it is not more dumb than attacking with a crosswbow 5 times in 6 seconds...
Try being stabbed with a dagger attached to a pole vs being poked with a broomstick. You tell me which one hurts worse. :P

For the second one I was just pointing out that they did not qualify as quarterstaves. I don't see how they're relevant to the conversation since if they're clubs they can't be used for PAM.

Finally, I never said crossbow expertise wasn't another stinker. Fortunately every player I've ever had agreed so it hasn't been an issue.

I fully accept that D&D is not realistic. Doesn't mean I don't want it to be reality adjacent and not have stupid visuals that make no sense whatsoever even in an action movie.
 

I was thinking about a ranger with the Druidic Warrior fighting style from Tasha’s who would use a quarterstaff with shillelagh and the Polearm Master feat. I noticed that the wording of the feat does not specify that you make your attack with two hands, and a quarterstaff is versatile. Does this mean you can use the Polearm Master feat with a quarterstaff and still use a shield?

Thanks!

Axe
As others have said, totally acceptable RAW. Personally, I am also fine with it. It really isn't OP or anything (you can do the same with a spear for the fighting).

If anything, the larger issue is with using Shillelagh for the staff do 1d8. Also, note the bonus action attack from PAM does only 1d4. The Shillelagh does not increase this to d8 as JC as ruled. IMO that keeps it within a more reasonable idea.
 

Try being stabbed with a dagger attached to a pole vs being poked with a broomstick. You tell me which one hurts worse. :p

For the second one I was just pointing out that they did not qualify as quarterstaves. I don't see how they're relevant to the conversation since if they're clubs they can't be used for PAM.

Finally, I never said crossbow expertise wasn't another stinker. Fortunately every player I've ever had agreed so it hasn't been an issue.

I fully accept that D&D is not realistic. Doesn't mean I don't want it to be reality adjacent and not have stupid visuals that make no sense whatsoever even in an action movie.
Take a cane fighting/self defense class & think about that again. Odds are good they will warn you not to do a few things with the foot
  • Don't jab the throat with the foot can easily break the hyoid bone & kill someone
  • Don't jab the face with the foot can easily break teeth, but more importantly can keep going & do awful things to the throat & possibly spine or eye & ocular cavity
  • Don't start with the head, attack the feet/legs/groin/belly & so on moving up as you can trivially break the skull & kill someone
They will probably also tell you how easy it is to break ribs & possibly cause them to puncture the lung by jabbing someone in the ribs with the foot. Getting "poked" with the end of a 1-2 inch thick stick is incredibly dangerous
 

As others have said, totally acceptable RAW. Personally, I am also fine with it. It really isn't OP or anything (you can do the same with a spear for the fighting).

If anything, the larger issue is with using Shillelagh for the staff do 1d8. Also, note the bonus action attack from PAM does only 1d4. The Shillelagh does not increase this to d8 as JC as ruled. IMO that keeps it within a more reasonable idea.
I'd also point out that one of the best uses for Staff/Spear one-handed PAM is being able to apply Dueling fighting style to all of your attacks; taking Druidic Warrior negates that outside of a Fighter dip or taking the Tasha's Fighting Initiate feat.
 

Take a cane fighting/self defense class & think about that again. Odds are good they will warn you not to do a few things with the foot
  • Don't jab the throat with the foot can easily break the hyoid bone & kill someone
  • Don't jab the face with the foot can easily break teeth, but more importantly can keep going & do awful things to the throat & possibly spine or eye & ocular cavity
  • Don't start with the head, attack the feet/legs/groin/belly & so on moving up as you can trivially break the skull & kill someone
They will probably also tell you how easy it is to break ribs & possibly cause them to puncture the lung by jabbing someone in the ribs with the foot. Getting "poked" with the end of a 1-2 inch thick stick is incredibly dangerous
I never said club variations aren't dangerous. But if I have a choice of being poked with a stick or poked with a stick with a blade on the end? All other things being equal? I'll take the blunt one.

My point was that fighting with a quarterstaff is different than fighting with a stick.
 

Legal by RAW - the only problem I have with it is the paucity of other feats granting bonus action attacks. Add in a few more of those and it's fine; as it is it's relatively strong because of action economy.
 

Yeah, I think we've covered this all before. The problem with polearm master including quarterstaff is, at it's root, a problem with the weapons table.

Club - Light - d4
Mace - nil - d6
Quarterstaff - Versatile (d8) - d6
Greatclub - Two-handed - d8

The problem is that "quarterstaff" is portraying two weapons: dueling cane and quarterstaff. But you can't do that because the weapons table isn't granular enough to put cane on the table and be mechanically distinct (setting aside how many indistinct weapons are on the list, especially at martial level). Essentially, the game is making quarterstaff be a normal quarterstaff, and a bo staff, and a jo staff, and a dueling cane, and a baseball bat, etc. The club is basically the size of a belaying pin or truncheon only. A mace is any shod or metal club. Anything long enough to be versatile is automatically a quarterstaff. Of course, mechanically, quarterstaff already invalidates both mace and greatclub, which really is stupid, but lots of people have problems with the 5e weapons table (e.g., why is "dart" still on the table instead of replacing it with throwing knife? Nobody knows what war darts are except war gamers!).

I don't understand why this is a topic of debate in a game where you can nearly die after being dropped repeatedly from 200 feet by a dragon only to swim away in plate mail & sleep it off with less lingering effect than the 1.75L bottle of high proof alcohol you drank before bed. If there was a specific cane weapon as displayed in the videos I linked earlier or any of the more advanced examples on youtubr or I could see the justification, but not as things are.

Breaking suspension of disbelief doesn't require doing extraordinary things. It requires breaking the conceits of the narrative. Here, one of the narratives is that melee combat is generally confined to the forms and styles of combat consistent with historical Western or European martial arts prior to the 16th century as portrayed in the mass media of the late 19th century through to the modern day.

Yes, you could in theory use a shield and then use a quarterstaff like a spear with no blade. The historical reality is that nobody carried a shield unless they were going to war. That means they were carrying a weapon built for war, such as a spear. A staff -- quarterstaff or otherwise -- is a weapon of convenience and social acceptability, not a weapon of war. That's why staves are weapons of monks, peasants, woodsmen, and gentlemen defending themselves from brigands. Nobody ever fielded regiments of quarterstavers on purpose, with or without shields. So it breaks suspension of disbelief.
 

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