D&D 5E The problem with 5e

[Don Durito]

I think solely having lingering injuries on mass damage would make it almost unheard of past level 5 where most combat characters will need to suffer 25+ damage. Even with crits that seems rare to me.

I may well keep it to a straight up Con save to avoid the crit effect. With failure resulting in a minor effect and a failure by 5 resulting in a longer save. DC being half the damage taken. Most fighters will pass a DC 10 save without too much difficulty and plenty of other classes too. Particularly with the many bonuses characters can get to saves. That keeps it real, gives them a reasonable chance of avoiding them but makes failure a common enough possibility.

As I said earlier, the main cause of lingering injuries is being reduced to 0 hit points, not massive damage. The other effects of System Shock still apply.

I drop the Con save to save time. Instead System Shock is D20 plus lowest of Con or Str with a 1 always being a 1. This means there is a good chance of system shock doing nothing (as the entries only go up to 10) and as Con contributes to that roll there is no need for an additional roll - (And Str actually matters for once in a situation where it should). Lingerining injuries only happen on a total of five or less. The threat is really enough.

Another reason to keep it for massive damage is that creatures with multi-attacks will not dramatically increase the chance of a lingering injury.

 

[TheSword]

As I said earlier, the main cause of lingering injuries is being reduced to 0 hit points, not massive damage. The other effects of System Shock still apply.

I drop the Con save to save time. Instead System Shock is D20 plus lowest of Con or Str with a 1 always being a 1. This means there is a good chance of system shock doing nothing (as the entries only go up to 10) and as Con contributes to that roll there is no need for an additional roll - (And Str actually matters for once in a situation where it should). Lingerining injuries only happen on a total of five or less. The threat is really enough.

Another reason to keep it for massive damage is that creatures with multi-attacks will not dramatically increase the chance of a lingering injury.

Ah I see! I like it. So in effect it a crit can increase the likelihood of mass damage and therefore a lingering injury, but not make it inevitable .

 

[Helldritch]

Ishhhh. If you really want to play with lingering injuries and severe trauma from massive damage. I urge you to try the Role Master RPG. You will get a simulationistic game where everything is covered. And I mean absolutely everything. From critical success to critical failure. Each weapons have its own table, each spells, each skills. Everything is codified. Absolutely everything.

But, believe me, this level of realism will put you down very fast and you will appreciate D&D for what it is: "A game where you are heroes".

 

[DND_Reborn]

Wrapping a serious injury, or having a bullet removed with greasy pliers, doesn't restore any HP.

I beg to differ. You could easy argue that once the bullet is removed, he doesn't' experience quite as much pain when he moves. Since he has less pain, he is more effective in combat, and thus gained a couple HP maybe? It really just depends on how you look at it.

Also, there is time off-screen we never see, maybe enough time for a "short rest", and he could have spent some HD during his rest and is able to press on.

The biggest issue with HP is when people think it has to represent injury, but it doesn't have to. It is an unfortunate thing and is obviously understandable because things like a poisoned blade does more damage than without poison. Well, the poison can only take effect if you are cut by the blade so you must be injured is such cases. shrug

For these reasons I explain to new players that hit points represent your "combat effectiveness." This is your ability to fight and press on, your ability to turn with the blow so it barely scratches you or perhaps doesn't touch you at all!

Anyway, many more posts to read.

 

[Don Durito]

Ishhhh. If you really want to play with lingering injuries and severe trauma from massive damage. I urge you to try the Role Master RPG. You will get a simulationistic game where everything is covered. And I mean absolutely everything. From critical success to critical failure. Each weapons have its own table, each spells, each skills. Everything is codified. Absolutely everything.

But, believe me, this level of realism will put you down very fast and you will appreciate D&D for what it is: "A game where you are heroes".

You like fish. You should go on an all Sushi diet.

 

[tetrasodium]

I beg to differ. You could easy argue that once the bullet is removed, he doesn't' experience quite as much pain when he moves. Since he has less pain, he is more effective in combat, and thus gained a couple HP maybe? It really just depends on how you look at it.

Also, there is time off-screen we never see, maybe enough time for a "short rest", and he could have spent some HD during his rest and is able to press on.

The biggest issue with HP is when people think it has to represent injury, but it doesn't have to. It is an unfortunate thing and is obviously understandable because things like a poisoned blade does more damage than without poison. Well, the poison can only take effect if you are cut by the blade so you must be injured is such cases. shrug

For these reasons I explain to new players that hit points represent your "combat effectiveness." This is your ability to fight and press on, your ability to turn with the blow so it barely scratches you or perhaps doesn't touch you at all!

Anyway, many more posts to read.

Almost sounds like in your example he was able to recover

Spoiler: 1d6+4hp

That's wildly different from the makeup crew restoring his outfit, doing his makeup back to the opening scene. & evensounds like less than a short rest.

That's very different from all hp half your jot dice, all spells & abilities, etc

 

[The Crimson Binome]

I beg to differ. You could easy argue that once the bullet is removed, he doesn't' experience quite as much pain when he moves. Since he has less pain, he is more effective in combat, and thus gained a couple HP maybe? It really just depends on how you look at it.

Hit Points are not a measure of combat effectiveness.

 

[Shardstone]

@Oofta you should stream your games. Every thread that has complaints about 5E you're telling people that if they just run the game different, their problems are fixed. If you streamed your games, I'm sure they'd be valuable learning materials!

 

[DND_Reborn]

Hit Points are not a measure of combat effectiveness.

What are they to you then?

Because according to the PHB, they are:

Hmm... "how tough your character is in combat (your ability to press on, ignore pain, etc.--sure sounds like your combat effectiveness, as in your ability to continue fighting) and other dangerous situation (again, your ability to press on, ignore pain, etc.).

So, if you treated them as such, you probably wouldn't have as many issues with them. Frankly since I've been treating them like that, myself, older players, and most importantly new players have no issue with the concept.

 

[Oofta]

@Oofta you should stream your games. Every thread that has complaints about 5E you're telling people that if they just run the game different, their problems are fixed. If you streamed your games, I'm sure they'd be valuable learning materials!

Yeah, but then people would know how horrible I am at accents. I couldn't stand the shaming I'd get from people not from midwestern USA when they realize how horrible my cockney brogue is.

If you have a serious question and not just a personal attack (because that would be against forum rules), that's a different thread. I can only relate my personal experience that 5E is as deadly as I want it to be.