D&D 5E What is the appeal of the weird fantasy races?

[Crimson Longinus]

So, no, I don't get upset that Call of Chthulu is Call of Cthulu and not DnD. But if I'm playing DnD.... I'd like to play DnD.

But there was a D20 Call of Cthulhu. So you could easily put all D&D races into it. Makes about as much sense than putting non-DS races into a Dark Sun game to me.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Hugely popular at my tables. I think I've seen a gnome at every table so far

I suspect Critical Role might have given gnomes a decent PR boost.

 

[Don Durito]

Why do people keep thinking that brining of Call of Cthulhu is relevant? Just because it is another game?

It is December now, holiday season. That means I want Egg Nog. Egg Nog is a big part of the holiday season for me. Do I want Egg Nog all year? No, but in December it is time for Egg Nog.

Would I be upset if Egg Nog wasn't offered at a 4th of July party? No, that'd be silly, it is the wrong time of year. Would I be mildly upset about going to a 4th of July party with no fireworks of any type? Yes, because that is part of the point of the celebration.

So, no, I don't get upset that Call of Chthulu is Call of Cthulu and not DnD. But if I'm playing DnD.... I'd like to play DnD.

Ok. So If I want to leave out elves I should just call it Dunjons and Dragons and everything will be ok?

I can understand that if you sign up to play D&D and then you make a trip for the game and suddenly the GM springs a whole lot of restrictons on you it would be annoying.

But I cannot fathom why anyone objects if this sort of thing is clearly signalled in advance. If you know what the game is then you know what it is - what has branding got to do with it?

A lot of Pathfinder 1e games would not allow tier one casters. If I want to play a wizard should I feel upset because they're part of the core Pathfinder game, or should I 1) play something else or 2) find a different game?

This is really what I don't understand. People are presumably ok with whole games being restrictive about what you can play - but the objection seems to come about when the restriction is the province of GM or group rather then a company.

It feels like people are saying that if something is published then they are entitled to play it - and I don't see it. As a player you are reliant on someone else to actually run the game for you (just as a GM you are reliant on people to play it) - the conditions that apply in such situations can never be anything then entirely up to the individuals to decide.

As a player I can say "I insist on playing a half-drow, half goblin gunslinger" or I won't play. I may have trouble finding a game, but it's my right to insist upon it. The Paizo boards used to have a GM playtester who insisted all PCs must be anime girls and that it was definitely not up for negotation. I don't see the issue with that. I certainly wouldn't play in that game, but apparently she found players who would.

 

[Zardnaar]

Dungeons and Dragons

It's never really made that promise though.

Tasha's. Everything's optional. PHB once again optional.

This is all RAW.

 

[Chaosmancer]

But there was a D20 Call of Cthulhu. So you could easily put all D&D races into it. Makes to me about as much sense than putting non-DS races into a Dark Sun game.

D20 =/= DnD

So... your point is that mechanics can be transferred, but that doesn't make them the same game.

And there are a lot of races in Dark Sun, so a "non-dark Sun race" is a pretty small pool compared to what people seem to think

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Yeah, I get a lot of "my way or the highway" replies in this thread.

People may be surprised to know that that's how it feels for both sides, in fact.

Edit: Though it's worth noting, only one side has claimed Ultimate Authority, absolute power, "my opinion [as DM] is more important," etc.
(Sorry, I misunderstood who was saying what in your post, Remathilis. I have corrected it now.)

 

[Chaosmancer]

It's never really made that promise though.

Tasha's. Everything's optional. PHB once again optional.

This is all RAW.

Everything being optional doesn't mean that a game about fantasy races shouldn't have any fantasy races.

Remember, the point of the post was more about archetypes than specifics. Saying that if you took out every sentient sea-dwelling race, then it feels odd. And DnD has always been a game about adding more races to each location. The monster manual is full of races.

 

[Zardnaar]

Everything being optional doesn't mean that a game about fantasy races shouldn't have any fantasy races.

Remember, the point of the post was more about archetypes than specifics. Saying that if you took out every sentient sea-dwelling race, then it feels odd. And DnD has always been a game about adding more races to each location. The monster manual is full of races.

It is doesn't you get to play them though even if they do actually exist.

Some of the humanoid ones sure. Even then it's an ask the DM.

In some cases could something exist? Sure does it no. It may have existed but not anymore.

I'm a "hardass" in this thread, even then you can ask just don't keep pushing it if I say no. No flyers is generally the only absolute I have campaign to campaign.

Loxodobs for example. Ravnica yes, last game yes, this game maybe.

Hell it might just depends who asked first.

 

[Chaosmancer]

Ok. So If I want to leave out elves I should just call it Dunjons and Dragons and everything will be ok?

I can understand that if you sign up to play D&D and then you make a trip for the game and suddenly the GM springs a whole lot of restrictons on you it would be annoying.

But I cannot fathom why anyone objects if this sort of thing is clearly signalled in advance. If you know what the game is then you know what it is - what has branding got to do with it?

A lot of Pathfinder 1e games would not allow tier one casters. If I want to play a wizard should I feel upset because they're part of the core Pathfinder game, or should I 1) play something else or 2) find a different game?

This is really what I don't understand. People are presumably ok with whole games being restrictive about what you can play - but the objection seems to come about when the restriction is the province of GM or group rather then a company.

It feels like people are saying that if something is published then they are entitled to play it - and I don't see it. As a player you are reliant on someone else to actually run the game for you (just as a GM you are reliant on people to play it) - the conditions that apply in such situations can never be anything then entirely up to the individuals to decide.

As a player I can say "I insist on playing a half-drow, half goblin gunslinger" or I won't play. I may have trouble finding a game, but it's my right to insist upon it. The Paizo boards used to have a GM playtester who insisted all PCs must be anime girls and that it was definitely not up for negotation. I don't see the issue with that. I certainly wouldn't play in that game, but apparently she found players who would.

What I don't understand is why people keep asking about other games like that is a profound statement of DnD. "You don't dribble the ball in baseball do you?" Isn't exactly a good retort for changing the rules for dribbling for Basketball.


And, I'm also getting annoyed with this continued pattern of "Well, players can just adapt or play a different game." Yes, but the DM can also run a different game. That is also a valid option.

DnD has been a game about Fantasy races since basically the beginning. This is a core part of the game experience. There is a reason the "joking insult" is that DnD is a "Magical Elf Game" instead of a "Fantasy Kingdom Simulator" or "Historical War Game" A large part of the appeal of DnD is the vast array of races, both that you play as and that you fight. Comparing it to Call of Cthulu, which is based on a series of novels and stories about Humans and Cosmic Horror, is just not a good argument, no matter how you try and make this about "why is it okay for the company to make these restrictions"

 

[Zardnaar]

What I don't understand is why people keep asking about other games like that is a profound statement of DnD. "You don't dribble the ball in baseball do you?" Isn't exactly a good retort for changing the rules for dribbling for Basketball.


And, I'm also getting annoyed with this continued pattern of "Well, players can just adapt or play a different game." Yes, but the DM can also run a different game. That is also a valid option.

DnD has been a game about Fantasy races since basically the beginning. This is a core part of the game experience. There is a reason the "joking insult" is that DnD is a "Magical Elf Game" instead of a "Fantasy Kingdom Simulator" or "Historical War Game" A large part of the appeal of DnD is the vast array of races, both that you play as and that you fight. Comparing it to Call of Cthulu, which is based on a series of novels and stories about Humans and Cosmic Horror, is just not a good argument, no matter how you try and make this about "why is it okay for the company to make these restrictions"

It's a valid opinion to have but you can't force DMs to do crap. They tried in 4E, didn't work they quit en masse sticking with 3E, going to Pathfinder and OSR also picked up players.

If WotC figured that out......