D&D 5E What is the appeal of the weird fantasy races?

[prabe]

But if they're not on board and there's friction, the DM only has themself to blame.

If there's friction between a player who wants to play a centaur (since that's the current example) and a DM who doesn't want a centaur PC, it's equally possible the player is to blame as the DM. I don't have centaurs listed as an available PC race in my campaigns; if a player tries to insist on playing one, and there's friction, I refuse to believe that it's entirely my fault.

 

[Gammadoodler]

According to the book with centaurs:

“In addition, any climb that requires hands and feet is especially difficult for you because of your equine legs. When you make such a climb, each foot of movement costs you 4 extra feet instead of the normal 1 extra foot.”

So apparently the trite refrain that “problems with verisimilitude are self-inflicted” is pure bunk. The book says it’s about 2.5 times harder to climb as a centaur. So they’re trying for verisimilitude and playability. Odd they don't mention how much upper body strength they’d need to pull themselves up a rope considering they have a naughty word horse for legs.

Is it as odd ... as the idea that centaurs exist? Or dragons? or 600 year old humanoids who don't sleep and can see in the dark? or creatures that are literally descended from devils, genies, and angels?

All that's cool, but centaurs climbing or being competent on a boat is preposterous.

Besides the silly believability line we're drawing here, assuming a world where centaurs exist, they are an intelligent species, with opposable thumbs. We can't contemplate that they might, at some point, have figured out solutions to problems of verticality?

 

[Gammadoodler]

If there's friction between a player who wants to play a centaur (since that's the current example) and a DM who doesn't want a centaur PC, it's equally possible the player is to blame as the DM. I don't have centaurs listed as an available PC race in my campaigns; if a player tries to insist on playing one, and there's friction, I refuse to believe that it's entirely my fault.

Sure, I would agree with that. I'm not suggesting that all games should have centaurs or that the DM should be required to allow it.

Just that if there's conflict where someone's crossed a believability line, the DM is the one who drew that line.

In a bit of a weird spot with this discussion, because while I've found the reasons given for many of the curated campaign worlds unsatisfactory, I'm generally on board with the DMs freedom to choose to run those curated worlds.

 

[prabe]

Just that if there's conflict where someone's crossed a believability line, the DM is the one who drew that line.

I think the DM's suspension of disbelief matters.

 

[overgeeked]

Is it as odd ... as the idea that centaurs exist? Or dragons? or 600 year old humanoids who don't sleep and can see in the dark? or creatures that are literally descended from devils, genies, and angels?

All that's cool, but centaurs climbing or being competent on a boat is preposterous.

Besides the silly believability line we're drawing here, assuming a world where centaurs exist, they are an intelligent species, with opposable thumbs. We can't contemplate that they might, at some point, have figured out solutions to problems of verticality?

Elves and dwarves and teiflings don’t need magic to climb a ladder. They’re roughly human shaped. Have you seen the back end if a centaur? They need magic to stop physics from tipping them back and likely taking the ladder with them. I’m fine with magic as long as there’s some realism, too. I’m good with flying dragons breathing fire who are hyper intelligent spellcasters because it’s pure fantasy and I don’t have to suspend my understanding of physics to imagine them flying. Because it’s magic.

To imagine a horse climbing a ladder...that means either physics is gone or there’s magic. Add a line about magic in their feet...hooves that lets them climb and move in physically impossible ways and I’m good. Without that, there’s a problem of weight distribution of a body ascending a ladder. Give them a 30’ fly speed only when touching a ladder or a wall or a cliff. I’d be good with that. Because that’s effectively what you’d have to do to get a horse up a ladder.

I get that the internet is a place to have opinions at other people, but come on.

 

[Gammadoodler]

I think the DM's suspension of disbelief matters.

I agree, it absolutely does. But it's not the job of the players to suspend the DMs disbelief for them, and the DM is 100% responsible for the way their setting functions. If your setting functionality is causing friction, it's your issue. You might not be wrong, but you're the one responsible, and you're the only one who can fix it (if you choose to)

 

[overgeeked]

I agree, it absolutely does. But it's not the job of the players to suspend the DMs disbelief for them, and the DM is 100% responsible for the way their setting functions. If your setting functionality is causing friction, it's your issue. You might not be wrong, but you're the one responsible, and you're the only one who can fix it (is you choose to)

It’s not the job of the DM to suspend their disbelief for the player’s entitlement.

 

[prabe]

I agree, it absolutely does. But it's not the job of the players to suspend the DMs disbelief for them, and the DM is 100% responsible for the way their setting functions. If your setting functionality is causing friction, it's your issue. You might not be wrong, but you're the one responsible, and you're the only one who can fix it (is you choose to)

One of the ways I make sure my setting functions is by restricting races. Nothing that flies at first level, nothing with more than four limbs, no warforged, none of the "monstrous races as PCS" from Volo's; anything else that's not on my "default yes" list, I'm willing to consider--or at least talk about--and I'm absolutely willing to work with a player to help them make a character they'll love to play.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Elves and dwarves and teiflings don’t need magic to climb a ladder. They’re roughly human shaped. Have you seen the back end if a centaur? They need magic to stop physics from tipping them back and likely taking the ladder with them. I’m fine with magic as long as there’s some realism, too. I’m good with flying dragons breathing fire who are hyper intelligent spellcasters because it’s pure fantasy and I don’t have to suspend my understanding of physics to imagine them flying. Because it’s magic.

To imagine a horse climbing a ladder...that means either physics is gone or there’s magic. Add a line about magic in their feet...hooves that lets them climb and move in physically impossible ways and I’m good. Without that, there’s a problem of weight distribution of a body ascending a ladder. Give them a 30’ fly speed only when touching a ladder or a wall or a cliff. I’d be good with that. Because that’s effectively what you’d have to do to get a horse up a ladder.

I get that the internet is a place to have opinions at other people, but come on.

I get it, the visual seems dumb to you. But if you decide that centaurs belong in your world as playable characters, you kinda need to get over it. Or you should take your lumps when players call you out for inserting rules that don't exist.

This is a problem the DM has complete control over from start to finish.

 

[Gammadoodler]

It’s not the job of the DM to suspend their disbelief for the player’s entitlement.

Pretty sure this hasn't been suggested anywhere. But hey I suppose this is the place to opine at one another, so..thanks I guess.