D&D 5E So Where my Witches at?

[Guest 6801328]

Sorry, Scott Adams is a big opponent of "cancel culture" and I'm pretty sure the point is Dilbert uses a correct word (acute vs a cute) and is attacked for being sexist despite not at all making a reference to her gender. The punchline is that after explaining that, it happens again (which vs witch) which will start the fight all over again. Believe me, Adams is commenting on how people take offense to perceived slights in innocent usage of language, which is the opposite of what you are arguing.

I'm sorry, but no. You are making bizarre assumptions about my argument. Sure, "Adams is commenting how how people take offense to perceived slights", I'll definitely agree with that. And very much from the side of "...and the people who do it should be mocked and ridiculed." In no way am I suggesting he agrees with my larger point.

All I'm saying is that this strip is evidence that "witch" means "difficult, unpleasant woman", just as much (or more?) than it means a certain sort of spell-casting figure. Which is why I think it's inappropriate to use it as a class name.

If "cavalier" also had a meaning as a derogatory term for gays, or "druid" was a derogatory term for the disabled, I'd offer the exact same argument against using those for class names. Since they don't, I don't worry about those names.

In other words, this is an entirely different argument than the one about accuracy in portrayal of Asian cultures.

Does that make sense?

 

[Guest 6801328]

What is the difference between a witch and an enchatress? five years of marriage.

Probably not your intent, but you just provided further evidence not only of the derogatory meaning of witch, but additionally in the context of it being funny to denigrate women.

 

[Mecheon]

Anyway, I guess we're stuck with warlocks for the foreseeable future.

If the Warlord and the Psion can't get classes, then no surprise the Witch can't get in either. Although I think the witch's history has been somewhat more stable than the 'how are these all the same class' of the psion

 

[Greg K]

I have a book for making 3e witches (The Witch's Handbook, by Steve Kenson), but it is not an official book. It is one of those small add on books released under the OGL. It provides the witch as a core class that is a hybrid cleric-druid, as well as prestige classes that can be good or evil. The Infernal Witch is one of the evil prestige classes I remember. Others include the Shaper, Witch Hag, Witch Priestess/Priest and Witch's Champion.

In my opinion, it is still one of the best D&D supplements for any edition let alone the best take on the witch for D&D (The second best being Mayfair's Witches for AD&D). My only complaint was the 3e prestige classes requiring one waiting several levels to qualify. A 5e version with 3e prestige classes as 5e Witch archetypes at 1st level would be my ideal Witch class.

(Edited: Removed reference to multi-classsing requirement. It has been several years since I ran 3e and I forgot that the Witch can qualify for most of the PrCs with 5 levels of Witch and meeting skill requirements. The Hag Witch had a requirement of being a female humanoid (non-hag) while the Infernal Witch had an additional requirement of forming a pact with a powerful evil outsider rather than skill requirements) @Elfcrusher (just so you see the edit)

 

[Greg K]

I don't remember seeing anyone post this link in the thread so far, but once again we can look to our old friend Kibbletasty for covering this concept. They have created a class (Occultist) and subclass (Witch) that could possibly serve people's needs:

THE OCCULTIST

I had already seen KibblesTasty's witch subclass and it was not what I am looking for in a D&D witch.

 

[Guest 6801328]

In my opinion, it is still one of the best D&D supplements for any edition let alone the best take on the witch for D&D (The second best being Mayfair's Witches for AD&D). My only complaint was the 3e prestige classes requiring multi-classing and waiting several levels. A 5e version with 3e prestige classes as 5e Witch archetypes at 1st level would be my ideal Witch class.

That sounds good, I may have to go find a copy.

 

[Greg K]

I think this (along with several others who have said things along similar lines) basically "makes the case" for the Witch as an independent class, with their own subclasses for the various flavors of "witch."

Class: Witch.
Potion making. Hexes/Hexing power (buff/debuff that increases with level). "Spell Focus" options (choose familiar or item or, how 'bout "Alignment: Good, Neutral, Evil" as a focusing ideal/power? "Are you a Good witch or a bad witch?" ), maybe determined by subclass. "Craft powers" determined by subclass. + feature 1, feature 2, feature 3, whatever else.

Mixed "Witch's spell list" of nature magic, illusions, charms, abjurations, limited "big/blasty" offsense.

To your spell list suggestion, I would add spells that transform (self and others) , some minor healing spells, and some divination spells . Personally, I would like to see the buffs and hexes handled as spells. I do agree limited "big/blasty" offensive spells and would take it one step further for no big/blasty spells (i.e. fireball, lightning bolt, etc.)

 

[Ashrym]

I use a bard, but then again I use them for most things. Easy to customize.

 

[Greg K]

That sounds good, I may have to go find a copy.

I made an edit to my original post. There was no multi-classing requirements for the Witch PrCs. I would also highly recommend Green Ronin's Shaman's Handbook by the same other.

 

[Greg K]

I use a bard, but then again I use them for most things. Easy to customize.

Honestly, the 5e Bard is the first time that I have really liked the D&D bard as it fits many takes on bards and wizards in myth, legend, and literature prior to the influence of D&D magic users on fantasy