D&D 5E Revising Classic Settings

[Emerikol]

I mean, the one way you are sure to anger all of the grognards is by misspelling their favorite campaign setting.

¯\(ツ)/¯

As a grognard who likes Greyhawk, and considering his various change proposals, I am fine with him keeping the alternate name for his setting.

 

[Urriak Uruk]

"If we try and make D&D sanitized of all controversial topics, the game cannot exist." That's true. But individual controversial topics should still be something you opt into. They shouldn't be a major focus of a product.
Slavery is a huge trigger. Right up atop the list with colonialism, sexual assault, and child endangerment. It's hard to think of a more divisive issue that carries more baggage.
Dark Sun's a campaign where slavery is major. Slavery's in every single city. It's tied into the backstory of humans and muls and half-giants.

Wizards is always gonna to publish big audience products. Always. Safe products. Middle of the road. Specially now when DnD is bigger than ever. They're not gonna to do weird, niche experimental products anymore. That's for those secondary publishers, like Kobold Press or Monte Cook Games.
Just like if someone at your table is uncomfortable with something you do not include it in your game, if the MAJORITY of the DnD audience is uncomfortable with something they won't publish it in a book. Or do their best to make it optional.

Wizards is trying extra hard to move past its racist origins at the moment and earn some goodwill. They're not gonna endanger that with Dark Sun. That's be like doing Maztika or Kara Tur. Wrong product at this time.
Maybe for 6th Ed. Dark Sun was just released last edition. Seems fair to give a campaign that wasn't updated to 4th Ed a chance instead.

I've already argued my point with slavery so I won't bother reiterating it, especially since 5E has already depicted slavery (I even included an image of it's usage in Mordenkainen's ToF). It is hyperbole to say that slavery is as large a trigger for people as sexual assault or child endangerment. I won't even say WotC is ok publishing "safe middle of the road products" when they published Tome of Annihilation (which has quite a lot of colonial references) or Descent into Avernus (Satanic Panic anyone?).

And saying the majority of the D&D audience is uncomfortable with slavery is a very different thing than saying a majority of D&D audience wouldn't want to fight against slavery in their games.

And your point on skipping Dark Sun because it was recently in 4E is backwards... it got published then because it's popular. It is one of the most likely to return, because it's still popular (at least more than Mystara, Birthright, and even Dragonlance).

To illustrate my point, here is a Tweet by Kristina Arielle (a more famous D&D player and POC) announcing her role in a live-play of a Dark Sun campaign.

 

[Disgruntled Hobbit]

I've already argued my point with slavery so I won't bother reiterating it, especially since 5E has already depicted slavery (I even included an image of it's usage in Mordenkainen's ToF).

And ya don't think Wizards might change in response to feedback to TOME OF FOES?

And there's a pretty big difference between some members of two races in one setting using slaves and every major city using slaves? You can use the Forgotten Realms without invoking slavery at all but you can't use Dark Sun.

And your point on skipping Dark Sun because it was recently in 4E is backwards... it got published then because it's popular. It is one of the most likely to return, because it's still popular (at least more than Mystara, Birthright, and even Dragonlance).

Was popular. With old gamers. Who are now outnumbered by new gamers who have no attachment to Dark Sun.
Like how Ravenloft became Wizard's biggest hit of a campaign despite not being hugely popular in 3rd Ed.

To illustrate my point, here is a Tweet by Kristina Arielle (a more famous D&D player and POC) announcing her role in a live-play of a Dark Sun campaign.

That's nice. Does that mean every African American is now cool with white people pretending to be a freed slave?

 

[Urriak Uruk]

Was popular. With old gamers. Who are now outnumbered by new gamers who have no attachment to Dark Sun.
Like how Ravenloft became Wizard's biggest hit of a campaign despite not being hugely popular in 3rd Ed.

I don't see any evidence for Ravenloft being WotC biggest hit of a campaign... it's popular because Curse of Strahd was released, a very well-written adventure. I don't know how you can make an argument that Dark Sun is less popular than less-supported settings, there's no evidence for this at all. I'll even provide the only evidence for setting popularity that exists, here;

D&D Monthly Survey | Dungeons & Dragons

dnd.wizards.com

The popularity of settings in the survey fell into three distinct clusters. Not surprisingly, our most popular settings from prior editions landed at the top of the rankings, with Eberron, Ravenloft, Dark Sun, Planescape, and the Forgotten Realms all proving equally popular. Greyhawk, Dragonlance, and Spelljammer all shared a similar level of second-tier popularity, followed by a fairly steep drop-off to the rest of the settings. My sense is that Spelljammer has often lagged behind the broad popularity of other settings, falling into love-it-or-hate-it status depending on personal tastes. Greyhawk and Dragonlance hew fairly close to the assumptions we used in creating the fifth edition rulebooks, making them much easier to run with material from past editions. Of the top five settings, four require significant new material to function and the fifth is by far our most popular world.

That's nice. Does that mean every African American is now cool with white people pretending to be a freed slave?

Dude, another strawman. Obviously not. But that doesn't mean ever AA is uncomfortable with it, or even most AA.

I see no reason for why a setting like this should be banned from republication if it is written by a diverse team of authors and sensitivity consultants. Hell, they've done the exact same thing for Ravenloft which also had some controversial material in it. That means things about Dark Sun should be changed and updated for modern sensibilities, but it doesn't mean it is off the table entirely.

 

[Faolyn]

Was popular. With old gamers. Who are now outnumbered by new gamers who have no attachment to Dark Sun.
Like how Ravenloft became Wizard's biggest hit of a campaign despite not being hugely popular in 3rd Ed.

In the dndnext subreddit, whenever someone asks what setting people want the most, Dark Sun is usually in the top two or three answers. And I'd guess that dndnext is populated by far more younger gamers than this forum.

That's nice. Does that mean every African American is now cool with white people pretending to be a freed slave?

That's up for each table to decide.

 

[dave2008]

This is something I would actually like to see as a DM suggestion in the DM's Guide. Or at least imply that the world one sets their campaign in have a standard rule set to match said setting, including races. Heck, for me, I'd even go so far as stating preferred classes.

FYI, the Theros setting restricts the racial options to PHB and the ones provided in the book (no elves or dwarves even!).

 

[Eltab]

That's nice. Does that mean every African American is now cool with white people pretending to be a freed slave?

Do you have an opinion you can stand up and explain / defend as your own? You keep hiding behind the possible (but not known) opinions of other people.

 

[Scott Christian]

FYI, the Theros setting restricts the racial options to PHB and the ones provided in the book (no elves or dwarves even!).

Ooh, thanks. I will check it out.

 

[dave2008]

Ooh, thanks. I will check it out.

 

[overgeeked]

That is not correct. They are actively working on two classic settings. However, the said they would like to get to all of them. Now, I find it highly unlikely they will get to all of them, but I am optimistic that they will not stop at the two the currently have in the pipeline.

Where specifically did they say that? Because the last info I heard about it was as the poster you're replying to said, they announced three classic settings returning. They did not announce all of them will return. Only three. There absolutely could be more in the offing. But that's not the announcement they made.