D&D 5E Is Paladine Bahamut? Is Takhisis Tiamat? Fizban's Treasury Might Reveal The Answer!

According to WotC's James Wyatt, Fizban's Treasury of Dragons introduces a new cosmology for dragon gods, where the same beings, including Fizban, echo across various D&D campaign settings with alternate versions of themselves (presumably like Paladine/Bahamut, or Takhisis/Tiamat). Also... the various version can merge into one single form.

Takhisis is the five-headed dragon god of evil from the Dragonlance setting. Paladine is the platinum dragon god of good (and also Fizban's alter-ego).

Additionally, the book will contain psychic gem dragons, with stats for all four age categories of the five varieties (traditionally there are Amethyst, Crystal, Emerald, Sapphire, and Topaz), plus Dragonborn characters based on metallic, chromatic, and gem dragons.

D&D 5E - Check out Fizban's Alternate Cover!

WotC's James Wyatt talked to Polygon about Fizban's Treasury of Dragons, which also revealed the alternate cover, which you can only get from hobby stores. https://www.enworld.org/threads/fizbans-treasury-the-dragon-book-now-has-a-description-and-a-feat.681399/

www.enworld.org

D&D 5E - Fizban's Treasury: The Dragon Book Now Has A Description... And A Feat

Courtesy of Amazon, we now have a description for Fizban's Treasury of Dragons, the October D&D hardcover. The book introduces gem dragons, dragon-themed player options, and plenty of draconic lore! This joins September's The Wild Beyond the Witchlight, and November's Strixhaven: Curriculum of...

www.enworld.org

 

[Parmandur]

That would be spectacularly awesome.

Only thing is, there are significant numbers of fans that would lose their collective minds if their pet setting was changed in a new edition. All you have to do is look at 4e to see just how acceptable it is to change existing setting lore. People absolutely freaked.

They just changed Ravenloft a fair bit, and it was well received. It isn't changes that are a problem, but the nature and execution of the change.

 

[Hussar]

She's a Chaotic Evil prisoner in the Hells. It's complicated, I suppose, but just because some mortals use words one way doesn't mean that is how things really are.

Also, it's all made up silliness.

Which "She" are you referring to?

And, while you are absolutely right that it's all made up silliness, I would point you back to the 4e edition war threads for how deadly seriously folks take this. One of the big issues with 4e was the change in cosmology. So, yes, it does really, really matter. Remember how folks lost their collective minds because succubi were no longer demons?

 

[Parmandur]

Which "She" are you referring to?

And, while you are absolutely right that it's all made up silliness, I would point you back to the 4e edition war threads for how deadly seriously folks take this. One of the big issues with 4e was the change in cosmology. So, yes, it does really, really matter. Remember how folks lost their collective minds because succubi were no longer demons?

Tiamat/Tahakis, same difference.

Tbing is, this doesn't really seem to be a change, as evidenced by how many people here already felt this was the case. And it was stated to be the case before I was born by TSR. Sooooo, not even a change.

 

[Umbran]

They do participate in the same abilities via an abstract Class in the Realm of Ideas...so, yeah, they kinda are.

Pish-tosh. They were that in prior editions. We could have it different now. We won't, but we could. I would prefer it be different now. To each their own, of course, but the Pan-WotC-Universe is not a construct I find compelling for storytelling.

 

[Zeromaru X]

Honestly, in the way Wyatt described it, it sounds like the difference between "great wyrm" and "deity" isn't terribly great. Perhaps nothing more than semantics for some cases for the most powerful great wyrms. I'm really curious to see how this is all set forth in the book...

I guess the difference is that Bahamut and Tiamat, and perhaps Sardior, are older than the current dragons. They started it all in the First World, while the other great wyrms dragons seems to have originated from the current multiverse.

 

[Parmandur]

Pish-tosh. They were that in prior editions. We could have it different now. We won't, but we could. I would prefer it be different now. To each their own, of course, but the Pan-WotC-Universe is not a construct I find compelling for storytelling.

shrug different strokes for differfolks. The Class-Level structure of D&D does lend itself to that universalism, for characters and for NPCs like gods and dragons.

 

[Umbran]

shrug different strokes for differfolks. The Class-Level structure of D&D does lend itself to that universalism, for characters and for NPCs like gods and dragons.

I ask again - are all barbarians actually Conan?

 

[Zeromaru X]

Nope, but only because Conan is not a WotC-owned character, lol.

 

[Parmandur]

I ask again - are all barbarians actually Conan?

They participate in the Eternal Barbarian, same as Conan. That's why they are D&D Barbarians, and not GURPS point buys.

 

[PsyzhranV2]

See, this is why I ignore all things Planescape.

Why would the Queen of the Abyss, Takhisis, have her plane on Baator? That makes zero sense. Heck, pre-Planescape, Dragonlance didn't even have a Hell.

My crack answer (definitely not canon):

Tiamat and Takhisis are emanations of another evil dragon god ("Tiamat Prime" from the First World). The two of them conventionally exist as independent entities with opposed temperaments, but ultimately are of the same essence, having been manifested by an even greater power that possesses both of their aspects.

Treading into real world territory here, but what I mean by emanation: in certain sects of Buddhism fully realized Buddhas, and Bodhisattvas of the 10th Bhumi, are believed to be capable of creating projections that are conventionally independent sentient beings, but ultimately are of the same mindstream as their source. These emanations typically take the form of spiritual guides, whether as benevolent gods, as human spiritual teachers, or even as animals who happen to be in the right place at the right time to provide inspiration to a devoted seeker. The most famous example would be the Dalai Lama lineage of tulkus, who are believed to be an emanation of the Bodhisattva Avalokiteshvara. I don't know if a similar concept exists in any Western religion, mythology, or folklore. (Tired, don't feel like I explained that well, but it exists).