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D&D General Has D&D abandoned the "martial barbarian"?

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Question for the DMs?
How would you adjudicate a barbarian powerbonbing or chockslamming a foe?

Grapple attack. If successful, make an unarmed attack with 10ft of falling damage plus target is knocked prone?

Question for the Designers?
How would you design such a feature as a subclass class feature or as a feat?
Only works when raging?
How much bonus damage?
 

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Tales and Chronicles

Jewel of the North, formerly know as vincegetorix
Question for the DMs?
How would you adjudicate a barbarian powerbonbing or chockslamming a foe?

Grapple attack. If successful, make an unarmed attack with 10ft of falling damage plus target is knocked prone?

Question for the Designers?
How would you design such a feature as a subclass class feature or as a feat?
Only works when raging?
How much bonus damage?
To make it simple, maybe just add a feature that deals X automatic damage when you Shove a grappled creature?
 

steeldragons

Steeliest of the dragons
Epic
Question for the DMs?
How would you adjudicate a barbarian powerbonbing or chockslamming a foe?
I do not actually know what either of these...maneuvers?...are.
Grapple attack. If successful, make an unarmed attack with 10ft of falling damage plus target is knocked prone?
OH! For something like that? Damage, forced movement and prone sounds right. Meh. I would say the "throw/knocking prone" is part of the whole grapple attack, so a second unarmed attack after a successful grapple would be unnecessary...for/from my adjudication.
Question for the Designers?
How would you design such a feature as a subclass class feature or as a feat?
Could work as either. Subclass feature for a particular type of barbarian....or a monk...feat for some other person who wants to take on/learn a bit of martial artistry.

Only works when raging?
Well, while I actually have something remarkable similar in my system/setting's barbarian class subclass, I would not make it dependent on raging. Just a level feature. Something the [or this subclass type of] barbarian can do.
How much bonus damage?
10' of falling damage would be d6? Or is it d10 these days? Whatever falling damage in 5e is. Probably, I would do the standard falling damage plus barbarian's Str. bonus...an additional d6 (or d10 or whatever it is) if they are thrown/slammed into a solid object/wall/creature at least one size category larger within that throw, before becoming prone. If you're not throwing them into a wall/pillar/what have you, I'd say ending up prone is really the bonus/boon of this kind of attack.
 

mrpopstar

Sparkly Dude
Question for the DMs?
How would you adjudicate a barbarian powerbonbing or chockslamming a foe?

Grapple attack. If successful, make an unarmed attack with 10ft of falling damage plus target is knocked prone?

Question for the Designers?
How would you design such a feature as a subclass class feature or as a feat?
Only works when raging?
How much bonus damage?
Maybe DC 10 Strength check to slam a creature you already have grappled, roll 1d6 + Str modifier if successful and the creature ends up prone? The creature has to be the same size category as you or smaller.
If raging the creature can be one size category larger and damage die increases.
 

Weiley31

Legend
The main trend going from 3e to 5e is that the fighter is the learned warrior. The fighter learns the secret techniques, knows proper forms, has the swordsmanship master, and reads training manuals. Barbarians mainly rely their might, speed, and toughness for weapons based victory. Their stances may be bad. Their forms may be sloppy.
Which is why Reckless Attack, technically, IS the Barbarian's Fighting Style.
 

Hussar

Legend
/snip

In AD&D (either 2e or post Unearthed Arcana 1e) assuming Str of 17 you only have +1 to hit and damage and 3 attacks/2 rounds, rising to 2 attacks/round at level 7. A longsword therefore does 1d8+3 damage or an average of 7.5/attack (9.5 vs large) for an average of 11.25 dpr. But this is extremely frontloaded as other than getting a magic +1 or +2 sword the next damage increase the fighter gets is the level 7 2 attacks/round and more likelihood of facing large foes.

By contrast in 5e a first level fighter with Str 16, longsword, and the duelist fighting style is doing 1d8+5 damage for 9.5 damage/attack or in round terms 20% behind. With only one attack per round this isn't looking so good - but that's first level. At second they gain Action Surge, closing about half the gap assuming the textbook 6 encounters, 2 short rests/day. At third they gain a subclass which (depending on subclass) finishes closing the gap. At fourth it's an ASI or a feat - and at 5th level they get their second attack, doubling their DPR and permanently ending the one reason the AD&D fighter was doing more damage.

Of course all of this is largely irrelevant when an AD&D ogre had 19 hp, a 3.5 ogre had 29hp, and a 5e ogre has 59hp. Fighter damage might not have been drastically reduced but hps were massively upped so the effect is the same. The fighter might as well be waving a nerf bat.
Well, that was my point, which you got to at the end. Sure, the 2e fighter might have been equal to the 5e fighter, but, since your opponent had 1/3 the HP, it does mean that the 2e fighter comes out WAY ahead. And, you're also forgetting that against that Ogre, I'm not doing 1d8+3, I'm doing 1d12+3. Additionally, the notion of a 17 Str fighter is pretty laughable to be honest. That 2e fighter will almost always have an 18/percentile strength, which massively ups the damage output, and will most likely be using a second weapon (because, well, if you're playing 2e, why would you not use 2 weapon fighting?) which, again, jacks up our fighter's raw damage output against opponents that are significantly easier to kill.

2e really was the fighter edition. And, let's not forget the other side of the equation as well. Those casters, of which your group probably only had 2, had very, very limited resources. I'm struggling to think of a mass damage spell in the 2e PHB before fireball. I'm sure there must have been some, but, none jump out at me from memory. Burning hands I suppose - which was only really good against maybe 2 opponents. The cleric, OTOH, had basically no damage dealing spells at all. Spiritual hammer at 2nd? Was there any damage dealing spells for clerics before 2nd level? In 5e, our 1st level wizard and quite possibly our 1st level cleric both have area of effect damage spells right out of the chute. Thunderwave is a good example. I'm sure there are others.

Like I said, track it in your next couple of sessions. Just see how much total damage the casters are doing vs the non-casters. It's shocking.
 

Garthanos

Arcadian Knight
It's less about instinct and more how they fight. The Champion still feel like they read swordsmanship manuals and subscribe to some old samurai's fan club for katana tips.
seems to me they take the openings spur of the moment with random crits ... unlike the battlemaster who decides things.
It does seem they are too careful for a berserk though so I will hand you that.

Risky Maneuvering The first opportunity attack you trigger on your turn enables you to make 1 extra attack this turn. You may voluntarily trigger an opportunity attack from one adjacent foe each your turns.
 



J.Quondam

CR 1/8
That's the books. In the comics and movies however....

+5 Fuzzy Underpants of Invincibility!

A1v4pGQfDgL.jpg
 

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