D&D General How do you like your ASIs?

[Scott Christian]

Again, it's not giving powergamers more power, it's giving people who have both powergaming and roleplaying tendencies the ability to satisfy both without conflict, instead of having to choose which itch to scratch.

The entire game is based on choices of which itch to scratch. I want to fly, have darkvision, cast divine and arcane spells, swing a sword, wear armor, and have the feat mobile - at first level.

You can't do that?

Why not? That's how I want to roleplay and powergame!

The change seemed to many to be a move, not based on mechanical logic or feel, but on pressure. That might be why it bothers so many people.

 

[Scott Christian]

But are they? When Amy has a 17STR fighter who is a half orc, and she picked half orc because she wanted a super strong fighter is that power gaming?

The answer is they are playing their character. The term powergamer, as I have stated, is an oversimplification. It's not a good term, and should probably only apply to a niche group of people that make all their choices based on how strong they can make their character. Are they an optimizing? I guess.

By the way, there is nothing wrong with either of these.

 

[Vaalingrade]

I disagree that the best way to introduce and enamor a person to a game of creative choice and imagination is strictly limiting them.

Also, keeping it simple by banning people from starting with the simple caster.

 

[Minigiant]

Like I said before.

The oversimplification is 5e created wonkiness in 5e.

Tiny characters should have Carrying Capacity of Strength Score x 5 and +2 AC.
Small characters should have Carrying Capacity of Strength Score x 10 and +1 AC.
Medium characters should have Carrying Capacity of Strength Score x 15.
Large characters should have Carrying Capacity of Strength Score x 30 and -2 AC

And the whole halfling, human, orc STR problem mostly disappears.

 

[Zubatcarteira]

I'd ditch ASIs and make the base standard array/point buy higher. If every race can get the same +2/+1 or +1/+1/+1, then there's not much of a point of having stats tying to race. If reinforcing a theme with each race is needed, they can get some ability that fits the niche.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Thats not what power gaming has ever meant.

Playing a heroic character is a theme of a game/story. There are only so many times you can explore the "save your village from goblins led by an orc" or "clear out the rats from my basement" story before you get tired of it. Skipping the rat/goblin phase and picking up a story when the group of heroes leave the town and head to the city is NOT powergaming.

Then start your campaign at a higher level. Removing the 1st tier would just ruin the fun for the rest of us.

 

[Vince_Snetterton]

The entire game is based on choices of which itch to scratch. I want to fly, have darkvision, cast divine and arcane spells, swing a sword, wear armor, and have the feat mobile - at first level.

You can't do that?

Why not? That's how I want to roleplay and powergame!

The change seemed to many to be a move, not based on mechanical logic or feel, but on pressure. That might be why it bothers so many people.

I have an example that speaks to your idea of "I want to do everything, and I want to do it now" movement that is prevalent in the D&D community today.

I got banned from a Twitch channel. It was a channel with a wanna be CR crew (They have set up their own Patreon, website, the whole deal). They had a whopping 26 in the channel at the time, while the DM and players were doing the funny voices, dressed up for the camera, the works.

One guy decides to cast Haste. He reads the first sentence in the spell, where it says he gets a second Action, but conveniently stops before reading the next sentence that clearly states what he can do within that spell.

So, he casts Misty Step to jump up 30 feet into a tower, (no problem there), then proceeds to cast a non-Cantrip, and then a second non-Cantrip (one of the concentration based Smite spells as he attack the NPC a second time).

This is what got me banned, within seconds:

vince_snetteton: This guy just butchered Haste. He has the mechanics all wrong. Read the spell. You can only do specific things with the spell, and he had already cast Misty Step, which is a Bonus Action. The DM has to know the rules, as well as this guy./
vince_snetteton: You guys can play D&D, or you can pretend you are in a Critical Role production. You can't do both. You are clearly not playing D&D.

 

[Maxperson]

To cut down the power a bit, what about +2 fixed and -2 floating?

In 5e the power is pretty irrelevant. A floating +2 doesn't mean much other than to make people happy and feel like they are getting something.

 

[Maxperson]

That turns on the meaning of stronger. A creature that can lift twice as much is stronger even if they do not have +1 to attack and damage with a martial weapon.

And yet not. Are they stronger? Yes. Strength score is also a measure of strength, though, and it's not possible to lift twice as much without also being stronger in the strength score, since that measures lifting. If they don't have a racial bonus to strength, the race is in fact also not stronger(strength score). This is nonsensical. You end up with what I said. It's simultaneously stronger and not stronger at the same time.

In fact, assuming the size is the same, since the strength score is what determines how much you can lift, giving a race the ability to lift double without also doubling the strength score creates a disconnect.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

I have an example that speaks to your idea of "I want to do everything, and I want to do it now" movement that is prevalent in the D&D community today.

I got banned from a Twitch channel. It was a channel with a wanna be CR crew (They have set up their own Patreon, website, the whole deal). They had a whopping 26 in the channel at the time, while the DM and players were doing the funny voices, dressed up for the camera, the works.

One guy decides to cast Haste. He reads the first sentence in the spell, where it says he gets a second Action, but conveniently stops before reading the next sentence that clearly states what he can do within that spell.

So, he casts Misty Step to jump up 30 feet into a tower, (no problem there), then proceeds to cast a non-Cantrip, and then a second non-Cantrip (one of the concentration based Smite spells as he attack the NPC a second time).

This is what got me banned, within seconds:

vince_snetteton: This guy just butchered Haste. He has the mechanics all wrong. Read the spell. You can only do specific things with the spell, and he had already cast Misty Step, which is a Bonus Action. The DM has to know the rules, as well as this guy./
vince_snetteton: You guys can play D&D, or you can pretend you are in a Critical Role production. You can't do both. You are clearly not playing D&D.

No wonder you got banned. It would have been possible to point out how the spell is supposed to work politely. This was not that.