D&D General How do you like your ASIs?

[Scribe]

Yes, some choices are suboptimal from an optimizer's point of view but from a role play and concept PoV nothing is changed except power creep.

I think just how much power creep this is, is debatable.

 

[TwoSix]

That was quite easy before with fixed ASI. Beside the power creep, floating ASI changes nothing as to what race you can play. Yes, some choices are suboptimal from an optimizer's point of view but from a role play and concept PoV nothing is changed except power creep. Floating ASI are simply a disguised way to get moarrrrrr Powaaaaa! The role play and character concept are just an excuse to hide the intention. I want to play a dwarven wizard, a half orc rogue, an elf paladin in full plate but I want my sweet 16...

Nothing but that 16 ever prevented you from doing these concepts and many more but the small cost of not having a 16...

Note:" And by you, I mean your side. Not you personally." Just clarifying...

But my whole point is that it ISN'T power creep. We optimizers (and yes, I have no desire to play a character with a non-16 unless I roll poorly instead of doing point-buy) aren't going to be able to pick better options, because V-Human and Custom Lineage are still the best options for almost every build. All the change does is actually let us play other options to try out some different ideas without having to have an aesthetically unpleasing +2 mod in our main stat.

It's only power creep when it raises the ceiling; all floating ASIs do is raise the floor for previously suboptimal concepts.

 

[Mecheon]

but from a role play and concept PoV nothing is changed except power creep

Is it, really?

What if I want a fire genasi who isn't inexplicably just, smarter, but instead is stronger because he's been working on a farm all his life, and just has average intelligence? Some farm folks just, had a kid who turned out to be on fire. Is that really power creep, or just, going in a particular direction for roleplay purposes? Heck, going on from that, switching out the Int bonus to Wisdom because he's just, people-smart and not book-smart.

Frankly its not power creep when the be-all end-all is V-Human which still remains atop. If anything, its rebalancing everything else to get up to V-Human's lofty standards. Hardly power creep when the top isn't budging at all and instead everything below it is getting more of a chance to shine.

Its rebalancing underpowered stuff. The power's remaining at the same top, just everything below is being given more chances.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

What if I want a fire genasi who isn't inexplicably just, smarter, but instead is stronger because he's been working on a farm all his life, and just has average intelligence?

Put nine in intelligence so they end up with the perfectly average ten, and put 14 or 15 in strength so they are pretty damn strong for a farm boy. Normal commoner has strength ten, so they would be significantly stronger.

 

[Scribe]

It's only power creep when it raises the ceiling; all floating ASIs do is raise the floor for previously suboptimal concepts.

Gotta say, @TwoSix has done in like 4 posts over a few threads, more than any number of people have over a year, to convince me that floating has some merit. LOL

 

[TwoSix]

Gotta say, @TwoSix has done in like 4 posts over a few threads, more than any number of people have over a year, to convince me that floating has some merit. LOL

I like to think that every once in a while, we can have useful discussion on these forums. But I'm an optimist.

For me, all I know is that I have two concepts I'm kicking around for our next games that I would have made a human or half-elf before TCoE, and now I'm going to make them a leonin and a bugbear, respectively, purely for the aesthetics and concept. TCoE opened up choices that I wanted to make aesthetically but would have felt uncomfortable about playing with a 14-15 stat, so I'm grateful for the rules change.

 

[BookTenTiger]

I like to think that every once in a while, we can have useful discussion on these forums. But I'm an optimist.

For me, all I know is that I have two concepts I'm kicking around for our next games that I would have made a human or half-elf before TCoE, and now I'm going to make them a leonin and a bugbear, respectively, purely for the aesthetics and concept. TCoE opened up choices that I wanted to make aesthetically but would have felt uncomfortable about playing with a 14-15 stat, so I'm grateful for the rules change.

That's the thing. No matter if folks say I'm choosing Floating ASIs for Powergaming, I just know that's not why. It actually removes the thoughts of Powergaming from my mind as I create characters!

 

[Scott Christian]

I definitely think dex barbarians should be thing. Barbarians are bizarrely aggressively locked to strength.

I played an all dex, wood elf barbarian once. He could move 110' and still attack. And opportunity attacks, at times, were almost useless due to his totem. He did not do great damage, but he was about the best scout I have ever seen.

 

[Lanefan]

I have to get home to see my DMG book. However 14 DEX and WIS gets you AC 14 and it doesn't go up until you take level ASI.

And it can't use magic armor nor shields.

Can it use magical defensive devices e.g. a Ring of Protection or similar?

Otherwise, I'd say the issue isn't that it starts with AC 14 - AC 14 at 1st level is fine, all things considered - it's that said AC doesn't increase fast enough to keep up with level-appropriate challenges.

I can't offhand think of a better way, though, that keeps Monks viable at low levels yet doesn't give them ridiculously good AC at high. Maybe knock off one of the Wis or Dex bonus but allow them to wear light armour?

Or give them some sort of dodging ability so they don't get hit quite as often? This could be something flat, that doesn't increase with level, making it more useful at low level than at high (by which point they've got other things going for them).

 

[Crimson Longinus]

I can't offhand think of a better way, though, that keeps Monks viable at low levels yet doesn't give them ridiculously good AC at high. Maybe knock off one of the Wis or Dex bonus but allow them to wear light armour?

I think not wearing armour is thematically important. I made unarmoured defence 10+dex+prof. Makes the classes less MAD and scales better.