D&D 5E Are ranged attacks too good in 5e?

[James Gasik]

Also, I don't DM that way, and I don't appreciate it if the DM does, when I'm playing.

The goblins are smart enough to figure out the same thing.

Felix could also ready an action to attack if the goblin rushes him, or take the dodge action.

Now at higher levels, a melee Fighter winning initiative might end up in a situation where they can't take their extra attacks on the first turn. That's why every character needs to have ways to act and react.*

It's like a Cleric who wants to go last so they can heal after the first round of attacks, but they could in theory cast a spell to prevent damage in the first place. The game affords you both opportunities and over the course of many battles, both scenarios play out.

*Sometimes the game doesn't a character these tools innately, but that's a whole different discussion.

 

[ECMO3]

Example goblins have short bows, not RAW goblins. There is no rule for how they are armed.

They have a shortbow attack in their statblock. Unless you nerf them compared to what is in the monster manual, or purposely play them stupid they should not charge in that situation. This is especially true when they can use a bonus action to hide.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Felix could also ready an action to attack if the goblin rushes him, or take the dodge action.

Right, exactly. It's kind of a stalemate here, which makes things interesting. And getting to go first, either to Hold Action (which can be done with movement) or to do something else, will almost always be advantageous.

I mean, I can't really believe we're arguing over whether it's desirable...for any class...to get a bonus to initiative.

 

[Ancalagon]

It is not binary. Ideally you go after the wizard and before the enemies.

It is also not given that the round ends before Gortrek had a chance to do their last action.

Ok, so in most combats, the PC win, so the last action is going to be by a a PC.

Assuming each PC is equally competent at finishing a fight (NOT a given!), and a party with 4 members, the initiative order means that there is a 3/4 chance of one or more PCs having one less round of action than the "fight finisher" did. The initiative winner has better odds of having more more round than the others.

You might say "well, that's just intra party balance, it's not that important" - fair - but if you finish the fight with good initiative there is also a chance that you made sure that the ogre didn't land one more hit or such.

 

[Bill Zebub]

...but if you finish the fight with good initiative there is also a chance that you made sure that the ogre didn't land one more hit or such.

This seems terribly obvious to me. This thread has really gone into the twilight zone.

 

[Maxperson]

Also, I don't DM that way, and I don't appreciate it if the DM does, when I'm playing.

The goblins are smart enough to figure out the same thing the players are. They're not going to either move within easy range and just stand there, nor will they dash and then just stand there. Maybe move 30', then Hold Action (which the players won't know...).

Maybe your goblins are. Goblins in most games that I've played in are usually stupid. They aren't orcs or hobgoblins.

A lone goblins would very likely charge the lone fighter Felix.

 

[Maxperson]

They have a shortbow attack in their statblock. Unless you nerf them compared to what is in the monster manual, or purposely play them stupid they should not charge in that situation. This is especially true when they can use a bonus action to hide.

I vary up arms and armor to make for a realistic encounter. It's absurd to think that every goblin you ever encounter will have a short bow. Some will be weaker than the statblock, and some stronger. It evens out.

 

[Bill Zebub]

Maybe your goblins are. Goblins in most games that I've played in are usually stupid. They aren't orcs or hobgoblins.

A lone goblins would very likely charge the lone fighter Felix.

It's a wonder Goblins aren't extinct.

 

[Maxperson]

Right, exactly. It's kind of a stalemate here, which makes things interesting. And getting to go first, either to Hold Action (which can be done with movement) or to do something else, will almost always be advantageous.

I mean, I can't really believe we're arguing over whether it's desirable...for any class...to get a bonus to initiative.

Maybe that's what time are arguing over. Not me, though. I'm just saying that sometimes it's better not to be first. That's not an argument that it's undesirable to have an initiative bonus.

 

[Maxperson]

It's a wonder Goblins aren't extinct.

Do all your fighters have signs around their necks that says, "PC fighter?" Mine don't, so the goblin isn't going to know a fighter class from a conscript.