D&D 5E What is balance to you, and why do you care (or don't)?

[GMforPowergamers]

No he doesn't. There's nothing much restrained about Superman, particularly Silver Age Superman. Fortress of Solitude, more pets than you can shake a stick at, powers that are capable of virtually any deus ex machina that a writer decided to pull out of his butt (issues of Superboy and the Legion of Super Heroes, particularly, come to mind).

I mean what year did the silver age end? 1970ish so 50+ years ago, that may be a bit outside what most people picture as superman (now maybed you are 60+ years old and this was your superman growing up... I am in that boat too when I talk about the superman I read in the 90's people remind me that isn't the same as today)

 

[Vaalingrade]

Balance is all about giving all the players an equal chance to shine.

Adn demonizing balance is usually about keeping the status quo for the spotlight hogs.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

so in Mutants and Master Minds they do it with having the same bonus to hit and damage, but one has it from super strength and one has it from training and special timing. You can trade off some of your bonus to hit for damage... but both are limited by your power level...

so a batman/superman at PL10 could both have +10 to hit and +10 to damage, or could have +8 to one and +12 to the other... and the bat/super trade is best (IMO) would be batman having +12 to hit and +8 special training damage, but superman has +8 to hit and +12 super strength damage

So a normal human can just train to able to punch as hard than a guy that can throw an aircraft carrier to the orbit? Yeah, I couldn't handle this sort of a system, way too absurd for me.

 

[Vaalingrade]

So a normal human can just train to able to punch as hard than a guy that can throw an aircraft carrier to the orbit? Yeah, I couldn't handle this sort of a system, way too absurd for me.

Not 'as hard', 'as effectively'. And that's the problem with 'verisimilitude', it's all about finding cases to exclude things with that as the basis instead of looking for explanations that allow fun things to exist.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

So a normal human can just train to able to punch as hard than a guy that can throw an aircraft carrier to the orbit? Yeah, I couldn't handle this sort of a system, way too absurd for me.

you don't punch as hard. You can't out str superman with batman... the damage modfire is just not ONLY how hard you hit. It is how well you take out the guys

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Not 'as hard', 'as effectively'. And that's the problem with 'verisimilitude', it's all about finding cases to exclude things with that as the basis instead of looking for explanations that allow fun things to exist.

Absurd nonsense is not fun for me. I know it is for you.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Not 'as hard', 'as effectively'. And that's the problem with 'verisimilitude', it's all about finding cases to exclude things with that as the basis instead of looking for explanations that allow fun things to exist.

yup... my warlock sold his soul but with no negatives... so he can at will speak with the dead. My fighter had a near death experence and can not at will speak with dead... IMG not a fighter///

 

[Jer]

So a normal human can just train to able to punch as hard than a guy that can throw an aircraft carrier to the orbit?

No - he's able to hit as well and do as much damage. There's nothing in there about how hard he hits.

(Also, and this is one of my personal bugaboos - the Strength score in RPGs is an abstraction that doesn't mean what it says based on how it's actually used in games. Why would someone who is stronger be able to hit more often? Also the amount you can bench press is often unrelated to how much damage you can actually do to someone. Strength doesn't mean Strength it means "some collection of attributes relating to athleticism that we're going to label as Strength" in most games.)

 

[billd91]

So a normal human can just train to able to punch as hard than a guy that can throw an aircraft carrier to the orbit? Yeah, I couldn't handle this sort of a system, way too absurd for me.

Keep in mind that Mutants and Masterminds doesn't do hit points. Superman punching you (your character) is forcing a Toughness save to keep from being KOed from his strength. Batman hitting with the same level of effect is, instead, forcing the same difficulty of Toughness save to keep from being KOed because he's chopping you in a nerve cluster.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

(Also, and this is one of my personal bugaboos - the Strength score in RPGs is an abstraction that doesn't mean what it says based on how it's actually used in games. Why would someone who is stronger be able to hit more often? Also the amount you can bench press is often unrelated to how much damage you can actually do to someone. Strength doesn't mean Strength it means "some collection of attributes relating to athleticism that we're going to label as Strength" in most games.)

mutants and masterminds aslo splits it up as str being to hit and damage but superstrength giving you more carry and lifting... so a str 12 with superstr 10 has a lifting/caring str of 62