Games with "terrible" follow-up editions

[aramis erak]

Oh, didn't know that. I have all the 5E books myself cause the art is amazing. Haven't got to play it yet though. Maybe I should get to reading them finally...

My last L5R 3E game ended about a year prior to the L5R 5 playtest.
One of the staff at my FLGS was a real downer... he had nothing good to say about L5R3, Clan War, nor the FFG version of the Card Game and the L5R 5E rules. He also claims to have been involved with Gold Era Story Team.

I'll also note: Edge is going down the same folly that AEG did - a D&D subflavor.

 

[Ath-kethin]

I loved Hackmaster "4e" and was sorely disappointed by "5e." It wasn't their fault; their license to use the AD&D/2e rules had expired and they had to move on with their own system.

But it just wasn't the same.

 

[eyeheartawk]

I loved Hackmaster "4e" and was sorely disappointed by "5e." It wasn't their fault; their license to use the AD&D/2e rules had expired and they had to move on with their own system.

But it just wasn't the same.

First time I played 5th Edition I thought it was just a really good joke.

It's like if somebody actually used the weapon speed rules from AD&D and made that the game.

It's practically required to use an automated spreadsheet to run a simple combat.

 

[Mezuka]

Well, the history of TSR and SPI wasn't anything for the former to be proud of.

Yes, I learned the full story years later. At the time there was no internet. It was hard to get factual information. Gaming info was only available in gaming magazines and newsletters.

 

[Ath-kethin]

First time I played 5th Edition I thought it was just a really good joke.

It's like if somebody actually used the weapon speed rules from AD&D and made that the game.

It's practically required to use an automated spreadsheet to run a simple combat.

That's a great way to put it!

In all honesty, Hackmaster "4e" would've made a decent 3rd Edition AD&D. It went places that official products didn't and had a more cohesive design feel behind it.

But c'est la vie.

 

[Willie the Duck]

Thing is, Many CT, MT, and TNE fans did NOT see them as set in the same universes.

GT fundamentally reënvisaged the OTU, into a MUCH higher traffic, much higher trade place than most prior editions had; many fans of high traffic from CT/MT didn't think it would be the levels of high flow that GT floors at in its assumptions...

T20 officially overwrote the Judges Guild version of the Gateway Domain area; Some were quite unhappy with that.

Hero Trav wasn't available long enough to actually matter...

I mean, okay.
They don't (with one exception in one of them and another in a different one) have the character creation career tours, age vs. skill balance, 2d6 resolution, and so on, so they aren't the same game system*. However, they have the numbered Imperiums; humanti split into Solomani, Vilani, and Zhodani; references to the ancients; alien races like Vargr and Droyne; and iconic locations like the Spinward Marches; so it's clearly also in some way the same game. If someone wants to say that's 'not the same universe,' my response would in general be 'good for you for having an opinion (that I don't share).'
*Admittedly TNE missed some of these as well.

I'm all for people liking what they like, saying what they like, and not feeling beholden to use those things in a new/different/side-iteration of an IP they don't personally like -- so long as they aren't raining on anyone else's parade. I spent more than a decade on the Citizens of the Imperium forum, and I saw both options in that regard.

 

[Jacob Lewis]

Why not replace "terrible", a highly subjective and negative term, with "controversial"? Otherwise, I don't see a point to this discussion except to give people another opportunity to bash something that other people my enjoy. Believe it or not, some people actually liked (and still like) those unpopular and uanccepted editions despite what the mentality of the herd thinks and insists.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Get out.
It was fantastic!

.it's skill system was a mess though

It was fantastic conceptually, but the degree of failure and the potential consequences for same were perverse incentive; the risks of using it were often greater than the benefits. And that almost entirely came down to the really low percentages of success.
Wheras the skill system was overly idiosyncratic (in that everything was a special case--not as bad as Powers and Perils, but bad).

 

[Thomas Shey]

Yes, I learned the full story years later. At the time there was no internet. It was hard to get factual information. Gaming info was only available in gaming magazines and newsletters.

I was participating in APAs at the time, so I got to hear about it in all its "glory".

 

[Jahydin]

I loved Hackmaster "4e" and was sorely disappointed by "5e." It wasn't their fault; their license to use the AD&D/2e rules had expired and they had to move on with their own system.

But it just wasn't the same.

What! The 5E's combat is so much fun though...

That said, the 4E books are among my prize gaming possessions, and if my house were to catch fire, that's probably the first thing I'd grab on my way out.