It is time to forgive WOTC and get back onboard.

[mamba]

But the OGL controls the market. The OGL affords the content that those youtubers talk about.

no it does not, that is what the fan content policy is for. Are you saying without 3pp content under the OGL they would have nothing to talk about? None of the videos I saw on those channels even covered OGL products...

At this point I am not even sure what your case is any more. It seems to have turned into 'buy everything and watch everyting, as otherwise you hurt content creators', but that is so ludicrous that I hopefully am mistaken...

Here is what I will do, I will continue to buy and watch what interests me, including 5e 3pp content. It will be less 5e focused but not less TTRPG in general. The 3pps will survive this, the ones I am least worried about are youtubers to begin with. As I said, they can easily branch out and as far as I am concerned actually should be encouraged to.

 

[ECMO3]

I saw several if not all of those you listed (except Pack Tactics which I have never seen) and others (e.g. Dungeon Coach) say that they will be expanding what they cover to include other games.

Not really. D4 deep dive and Treantmonk said they would not do other games. Treantmonk saying he might some time in the future but couldn't at this time because he did not know the rules to other games. Dungeon Dudes stated they would be doing mostly 5E content but they were going to include more 5E content from 3rd party creators. They said they would report on other games but said the majority would be 5E.

I don't think Ginny Di said either way, but she said her business future was uncertain.

Treantmonk, d4 Deep Dive, Pack Tactics and Dungeon Dudes have all posted new optimization videos based on 5E WOTC content in the last two weeks. None of them posted any optimization content on other games or other 5E creators. They did post some details and "stories" about playing Pathfinder or other games they would try as well as videos on the OGL debacle but that is not the sort of content that they normally "sell" as their product.

 

[ECMO3]

Are you saying without 3pp content under the OGL they would have nothing to talk about?

Yes that is almost exactly what I am saying. Or more accurately if there are not people playing 5E and using WOTC content they will have nothing to talk about.

At this point I am not even sure what your case is any more. It seems to have turned into 'buy everything and watch everyting, as otherwise you hurt content creators', but that is so ludicrous that I hopefully am mistaken...

Making a decision to leave 5E and WOTC hurts the creators that are making money off of it. That is undeniably true.

The 3pps will survive this, the ones I am least worried about are youtubers to begin with. As I said, they can easily branch out and as far as I am concerned actually should be encouraged to.

They can not easily branch out, especially if there is not a market to branch out into. There is a reason they do almost exclusively 5E content.

 

[mamba]

Yes that is almost exactly what I am saying. Or more accurately if there are not people playing 5E and using WOTC content they will have nothing to talk about.

if those people do not simply disappear but instead play PF2, or SotWW, or what have you, then they still have something to talk about. I am not seeing 5e disappearing, if anything I see it becoming a wider tent with additions by Kobold Press, Cubicle 7, and maybe others. If they focus on WotC D&D only, then that is their choice.

Making a decision to leave 5E and WOTC hurts the creators that are making money off of it. That is undeniably true.

me not watching a video has no impact. Esp. when I pretty much never watched them to begin with. When I was defending the OGL 1.0a, it was not about youtubers, and it still isn't (to me). So if the best you have is youtubers, then I guess I am just not all that interested.

They can not easily branch out, especially if there is not a market to branch out into. There is a reason they do almost exclusively 5E content.

there is plenty of stuff they could cover. I understand that there are less viewers for it, but if your fear is that doing 5e exclusively is dooming you and yet that is all you do, then I just cannot help you.

 

[EthanSental]

Let’s look at the million dollar Kickstarter list on Enworld.

23 over a million.
5e related - 15
Apocalypse - 1
Cypher - 1
Year zero engine - 1
D100 - 1
D12 - 1
3 that I couldn’t find rule system for (1ring 2nd edition, 7th sea, and Monty python).

No pathfinder 3pp over a million and other so called popular systems people could move too.

I’m sure if we went to 900k, we’d have even more 5e 3pp like advanced level up.

I think the point is - if 3pp publishers want to make a living doing games, 5e is the game space to be. The others don’t have the following to support multiple companies making game content, much less the side things like podcast, videos, etc.

So I would suggest, those upset about this, give it time like a bad break up and let time heal the wound cause 1-2 years down the line when 1 dnd comes out and it’s potentially flying off the shelf, some people will be looking for a game group to play other lesser known or lesser liked systems…all because of a 3 week time span where they were upset with WoTC.

 

[mamba]

I think the point is - if 3pp publishers want to make a living doing games, 5e is the game space to be. The others don’t have the following to support multiple companies making game content, much less the side things like podcast, videos, etc.

I actually see it the other way around. If you do podcasts or videos, you doing an episode on something other than D&D is much easier and cheaper than if you create e.g. adventure modules. So I understand those creating actual products sticking with 5e for the most part, but those creating content can easily branch out and I would definitely want them to.

 

[ECMO3]

if those people do not simply disappear but instead play PF2, or SotWW, or what have you, then they still have something to talk about. I am not seeing 5e disappearing, if anything I see it becoming a wider tent with additions by Kobold Press, Cubicle 7, and maybe others. If they focus on WotC D&D only, then that is their choice.

Only if they all go to the same alternative content.

If I have 10,000 subscribers right now on my 5E channel and they all leave -

1. If ALL of them go to PF2 I could follow and continue with little impact to my business (aside from the time to learn a new system)

2. On the other hand if 2000 go to PF2, 2000 stay on 5E, 2000 go to COC, 2000 go to SotWW and 2000 go to GURPS. Now my business model is destroyed.

 

[EthanSental]

I actually see it the other way around. If you do podcasts or videos, you doing an episode on something other than D&D is much easier and cheaper than if you create e.g. adventure modules. So I understand those creating actual products sticking with 5e for the most part, but those creating content can easily branch out and I would definitely want them to.

Why would they if the new content non 5e get 1k views and the 5e gets 30k for a 15 minute videos?

 

[ECMO3]

I actually see it the other way around. If you do podcasts or videos, you doing an episode on something other than D&D is much easier and cheaper than if you create e.g. adventure modules. So I understand those creating actual products sticking with 5e for the most part, but those creating content can easily branch out and I would definitely want them to.

I do not think this is true. Not if iy is your source of income anyway.

 

[Faolyn]

Right and if you did not buy them because of what happened with the OGL or because you are swearing off WOTC then you hurt those creators of the stuff you did not buy/watch/interact with.

And you're hurting the people who are creating material for non-D&D games if you only buy D&D stuff.

The vast majority of RPG players do not have unlimited funds. Why should we buy from WotC when we can buy from any of the other hundreds of companies out there and support those creators?