D&D 5E Wizards Do Suck;)

[jgsugden]

It is like people don't see the subclasses, the versatility and the unique niche as The Intelligence class.

I've played 2 wizards to 20th in 5E. Both were an absolute blast. One was an enchanter, one a Songblade. I'm very much looking forward to playing a Diviner for more than a few sessions or an Illusionist. I will likely not get my opportunity before the new edition.

Nothing in 5E sucks. There are a few things that could be better, but this edition is really good or above across the board.

 

[Zardnaar]

It is like people don't see the subclasses, the versatility and the unique niche as The Intelligence class.

I've played 2 wizards to 20th in 5E. Both were an absolute blast. One was an enchanter, one a Songblade. I'm very much looking forward to playing a Diviner for more than a few sessions or an Illusionist. I will likely not get my opportunity before the new edition.

Nothing in 5E sucks. There are a few things that could be better, but this edition is really good or above across the board.

You picked two of the better subclasses and got them all tge way to level 20.

That's kind of the exception to the rule. Your diviner idea is also on of the most powerful subclasses.

Illusionists are either great or useless depending on the DM/campaign.

 

[Fanaelialae]

Sorcerers get most of those spells you mentioned, Bards get most iirc.

Wizards don't get more spell slots do that large spell list doesn't matter that much.

Wizards can prepare spells. Bards and sorcerers have spells known. Being able to change out your spells each day is a very significant advantage. One that I've frequently leveraged while playing wizards (as well as clerics and druids), and one that I sorely miss when playing bards.

Neither sorcerers nor bards get access to the full wizard spell list. Both classes miss out on some very good spells.

 

[jgsugden]

You picked two of the better subclasses and got them all tge way to level 20.

That's kind of the exception to the rule. Your diviner idea is also on of the most powerful subclasses.

Illusionists are either great or useless depending on the DM/campaign.

Well, it seems like you're saying 4 of the subclasses can be fun - I'll toss in Transmuter as a 5th because Caleb in Critical Role was a blast - so I'm not seeing the suck.

If you're saying that it kind of sucks that games end before the highest levels - yeah. I agree. It is one of the questions I ask a DM before the game begins: How long do you intend to run the campaign? That does influence what character I start playing ...

... but I would play a wizard knowing it would only go to 10. I've played a few other wizards during these years and some of them only were for a few short levels. I have enjoyed every single character I played in 5E from a mechanics perspective with only one exception - and that was due to a combination of mechanics and campaign setting not meshing, honestly.

Nothing sucks. Sucks would inherently mean they're not fun. They are fun. People have a lot of fun playing wizards. If even a few people report playing wizards and having fun, it means that they do not suck. Simple. As. That.

 

[Zardnaar]

Well, it seems like you're saying 4 of the subclasses can be fun - I'll toss in Transmuter as a 5th because Caleb in Critical Role was a blast - so I'm not seeing the suck.

If you're saying that it kind of sucks that games end before the highest levels - yeah. I agree. It is one of the questions I ask a DM before the game begins: How long do you intend to run the campaign? That does influence what character I start playing ...

... but I would play a wizard knowing it would only go to 10. I've played a few other wizards during these years and some of them only were for a few short levels. I have enjoyed every single character I played in 5E from a mechanics perspective with only one exception - and that was due to a combination of mechanics and campaign setting not meshing, honestly.

Nothing sucks. Sucks would inherently mean they're not fun. They are fun. People have a lot of fun playing wizards. If even a few people report playing wizards and having fun, it means that they do not suck. Simple. As. That.

You can have fun with anything even monks. If you were designing oneD&D though....

You may also be the "wizard guy" idk. You're an experienced player who knows how to leverage the class well. And you've identified some of the more powerful subclasses and play them to high levels.

In that scenario they're fine. 70% of games lvl 1-7 probably similar to real life.

 

[Oofta]

Here I thought wizards were the Batman of D&D. They always having just the right thing prepared for whatever situation arises.

But personally I can have fun with any class.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Just delete them and we don't have to talk about them anymore.

 

[jgsugden]

You can have fun with anything even monks. If you were designing oneD&D though....

You may also be the "wizard guy" idk. You're an experienced player who knows how to leverage the class well. And you've identified some of the more powerful subclasses and play them to high levels.

In that scenario they're fine. 70% of games lvl 1-7 probably similar to real life.

Again, I've had fun playing them at low levels - the ones I ran to high level, and the others that didn't get the full run. They don't suck at levels 1 to 7. They don't suck for a one shot. They don't suck.

 

[cbwjm]

Wizards don't even get full access to their spell list, they get a truncated selection that, if they're lucky, can expand via found scrolls. Even if they had access to all of their spell list, the issue becomes which spells to prepare. People always talk about "why have X class when a wizard can just cast a spell" but if the wizard doesn't have the spell, say knock, prepared then it doesn't count for anything. Add to that the resource cost of expending a spell slot and I'll bet that any wizard would love to have a rogue available to pick any locks the run into.

Wizards gain a lot of power at high level, except those high level spells are once a day, if you only need those spell slots once a day, great, but if you've used your one 9th level spell and then have another encounter where your one 9th level spell prepared would be super useful, too bad.

I like wizards, probably my favourite class in any edition, but people often make out that they are super powerful (in 5e) when instead, they're just powerful, so long as they have spell slots available and maybe a day to prepare that spell that would be really useful to have right this minute.

 

[Vaalingrade]

No, they suck. For many reasons heretofore enumerated. they've proven to be actually bad for the game as a whole as their ever-expanding Discworld butts expand to engulf the entire playspace.