Doctor Who 60th Anniversary Specials [[SPOILERS!!]]

[Twiggly the Gnome]

Oh yeah, my interpretation is definitely a stretch! But we are trying to salvage a runaway line from a story arc that aired 37 years ago and belongs to an era of the show that is grealy maligned for its writing, so any workable version of the Valeyard will definitely take a loooot of creative liberties with the concept.

You do have this bit more recently...



... "He will have other names before the end; the Storm, the Beast, the Valeyard."

 

[MarkB]

I guess. Technically. It requires us to believe they knew that he’d have more than 13 incarnations which is a stretch. But I suppose… technically they never said they didn’t know that.

I'm pretty sure they knew that if the Doctor got through all thirteen incarnations and the show was still popular, they wouldn't just shrug and say "Well, that's all folks" after the current actor retired. But they also knew that they weren't the ones who'd have to solve that little problem.

 

[Richards]

Wow. That episode...well, sucked. And sucked hard.

So, let me get this straight: the Celestial Toymaker, a being from outside our normal universe, an entity that can turn bullets into rose petals, was defeated because he...couldn't catch a ball? And, having not caught the ball, did not have the ability to make the ball simply fly back up into his hand? Or teleport to his hand? Or, since we saw several of him in rapid succession doing his "dance video" sequence there in UNIT headquarters, he couldn't suddenly appear on the ground outside UNIT headquarters and catch the ball after it fell over the edge of the projecting bit of building they were playing on? Any of those seem like they would be well within the "rules" of catch, which seem to be "catch the ball after it is thrown by another player," so it's not like he would be cheating by doing so.

And the Doctor, who earlier defeated the Celestial Toymaker at his own games in an earlier incarnation, now had no better plan to stop him than "let's cut cards and see who picks the higher card?" This is the Doctor's brilliant stratagem? (I guess it's a good thing he had "let's play catch" as a brilliant backup plan, huh?)

And didn't the Doctor and Donna have an issue, in the previous adventure (which was literally just minutes ago in their timeline), where separating was a bad idea? That lesson apparently didn't sink in, as the first thing they do when trapped inside the Toymaker's workshop halls of endless doors is to separate themselves on either side of a door, then each go wandering off. (Oh, but the door was locked when it was closed! Too bad the Doctor doesn't have a sonic screwdriver designed to open locked doors, huh?)

This was insulting on so many levels. The concept of "bi-regeneration" was terrible (as others have pointed out, it's basically telling Gatwa "Congratulations! You're the new Doctor! But we have a potentially better Doctor on hand to rescue the series in case you run it into the ground" - what a vote of confidence!), the plot was nonsensical (I'm with the new science adviser: in all these years, we've never been able to pick up the image of a laughing ventriloquist dummy hidden behind every single television broadcast, ever?), and even the ending, with the 14th Doctor "learning" what it's like to stay in one time period for awhile was ridiculous - didn't the 12th Doctor spend "one final night" with River Song on a planet where "one night" equals something like 61 years? And the TARDIS has an oversized wacky prop mallet stored in its floorplates for emergencies, in case you ever need to whack another TARDIS out of the existing one?

I can only shake my head in disbelief. Great job, Davies.

I wish Gatwa well in the role. Hopefully he'll be given better scripts to work with in the rest of his tenure as the Doctor.

Johnathan

 

[Hussar]

And here I really enjoyed that.

 

[Tonguez]

And here I really enjoyed that.

Yeah I’m kind of torn, if you suspend logic and go with the rules of play it was a wacky enjoyable romp with Neil Patrick Harris camping it up with the bad accents, facials and dancing.

But the dumb of it was still glaring, with so many cliches and self indulgences (many mentioned above) I would love to see the Celestial Toymaker again but they get popped off by a missed ball and a wish?
and I agree it does a dis-service to Gatwa to have the other Doctor still around and it also does nothing to resolve anything regarding Tenants face returning. At least becoming the Valeyard would have given a purpose for Tenant continuing post bi-generation.

 

[Hussar]

I actually thought it made sense. This is a new doctor - one that isn't dealing with the angst of his history. They did make that rather clear that the point of the bi-generation was to give the Doctor a chance to stop and reflect. To actually understand what he's fighting for. We've had several angsty doctors, it would be nice to have one that seems to be free to be less tormented for a change.

They make a point of going through the Doctor's MANY losses. All the companions who've died while "on the job". And the point of the story is that the Doctor never grieved. He just keeps running faster and faster, never actually escaping anything. Never dealing with anything. Always just moving forward.

Now, the Doctor actually gets to stop and rest. To grieve. To stop running, long enough to deal with all that grief that he's dealing with. What is Gatwa's line? They're Timelords, they're doing things the wrong way around?

I thought the story was actually quite poinant.

 

[Tonguez]

Now, the Doctor actually gets to stop and rest. To grieve. To stop running, long enough to deal with all that grief that he's dealing with. What is Gatwa's line? They're Timelords, they're doing things the wrong way around?

I thought the story was actually quite poinant.

except he hasnt stopped - before episode ends we learn he’s taken Rose to Mars and whipped Mel back to the 1880s - He’s not resting, he’s still travelling, still dicing with the universe.

and if Tenant is still travelling what makes Gatwa Doctors adventures any more important than Tenant Doctors trips? Afterall in the past multiple Doctors getting together onscreen was a major cosmic event - now Gatwa just needs to nip over to Donnas for a cuppatea

 

[Hussar]

except he hasnt stopped - before episode ends we learn he’s taken Rose to Mars and whipped Mel back to the 1880s - He’s not resting, he’s still travelling, still dicing with the universe.

and if Tenant is still travelling what makes Gatwa Doctors adventures any more important than Tenant Doctors trips? Afterall in the past multiple Doctors getting together onscreen was a major cosmic event - now Gatwa just needs to nip over to Donnas for a cuppatea

Meh. They were making a joke. A couple of not very big trips - basically sight seeing. Just for a laugh.

There is a danger in reading a bit too much into things. The point is still very much made. This is the Doctor being given a chance to heal.

 

[Morrus]

So, let me get this straight: the Celestial Toymaker, a being from outside our normal universe, an entity that can turn bullets into rose petals, was defeated because he...couldn't catch a ball? And, having not caught the ball, did not have the ability to make the ball simply fly back up into his hand? Or teleport to his hand? Or, since we saw several of him in rapid succession doing his "dance video" sequence there in UNIT headquarters, he couldn't suddenly appear on the ground outside UNIT headquarters and catch the ball after it fell over the edge of the projecting bit of building they were playing on? Any of those seem like they would be well within the "rules" of catch, which seem to be "catch the ball after it is thrown by another player," so it's not like he would be cheating by doing so.

I guess you can decide for yourself what the rules of the game are. As they said early, the Toymaker doesn't cheat and Russell T Davies clearly doesn't believe that to be within the rules.

It's fantasy, basically. The Toymaker is Q but is bound by his own rules.

And the TARDIS has an oversized wacky prop mallet stored in its floorplates for emergencies, in case you ever need to whack another TARDIS out of the existing one?

While I agree that was a bit Harry Potter, I don't think the mallet was important. It was the 'wish' he won--he wished for a new TARDIS (Tennant wished for the Toymaker to be banished). He just used the mallet for dramatic effect. I'd have to watch it again to be sure though.

 

[Rabulias]

I thought this episode was fun. Neil Patrick Harris is a nice addition to the Who universe. And it looks like UNIT stole the plans for Avengers Tower...