D&D General other possible elements?

[Yaarel]

Have you got a source for this. Google can't find it because wherever it is it's its buried under pages of songs containing lyrics of the general form "...fire that burns. Fire..." where the second "fire" is part of a new sentence

The algorhithms of internet search engines today are bad, because they rely on "trends" rather than on established sites of information. The engines are almost useless for any serious searches, such as academic details.


With regard to how medieval alchemists interpreted the helenistic elements, and applied them for metallurgy and astronomy, Rambam ("Maimonides") is knowledgeable. During the late 1100s, Rambam mentions the four states of matter in his work in Hebrew, Mishna Tora (Hilkhot Ysode Ha Tora 3). He clarifies that these arent four different elements, but rather four different "forms" that any "clump" of elements might take. In other words, these are four states of matter − solid, liquid, gas, and plasma − not elements per se. He also describes the vacuum of outer space as being void of matter but pervaded by gravity, the farthest "orbiting" that is an immaterial "force". This fifth element, quintessence, is made out of "force" and is unlike the four states of matter. In his Guide for the Perplexed, he mentions a kind of "fire" called "darkness" that is between the earth and the moon, where this dark fire describes the plasmasphere of invisible nonluminous nonthermal plasma.


It would take me some time to track down the phrase, "fire that burns fire". It is one of the ways to distinguish the alchemical "fire" from the ordinary fire of a candle. The alchemical fire refers to the state of matter that prevails in the "heavens", beyond the earth. If I recall correctly, it derives from a biblical verse, where Elijah calls down fire from the heavens. This "fire from God" was able to eat the entire altar, including the burning offering itself that is rising up in fire, along with eating the wood and even the stones and the dust. The alchemists understood this verse to mean, this heavenly fire is a state of matter that is able to destroy any form of matter. It is unlike ordinary fire. The heavenly fire can burn fire.

These alchemist are doing real things, like figuring out how to make good steel for weapons. The alchemy is also a comprehensive (proto) science that seeks to understand how everything fits together, from the stars of the heavens to the laboratory to ones own spiritual wellbeing. This is where the modern physical sciences of today evolve from. Essentially what happens is, modern sciences will split the alchemical science into two separate sciences: "hard" physical sciences such as chemistry, and "soft" human sciences such as psychology.

 

[Richards]

The Skylanders console games had 10 elements (not all at first; they started with eight and "discovered" the last two later on in the series), each with their own color:

Air (light blue)​

Earth (brown)​

Fire (red)​

Life (green)​

Magic (purple)​

Technology (orange)​

Undead (gray)​

Water (dark blue)​

​

Dark (black)​

Light (white)​

Not sure if that's any help, but my son once ran a 26-adventure Skylanders D&D 3.5 campaign to introduce by 10-year-old nephew to the concept of TTRPGs. So the concept is at least viable.

Johnathan

 

[Yaarel]

For AD&D 1e, the Wizard (Magic-User) was the only "mage". It was every kind of magic.

But today in D&D 5e, the Wizard is only one among several kinds of magic.

It might be worthwhile to equate "Arcane" magic with a D&D version of reallife historical alchemy. This is a magic that derives from the magical properties of ordinary objects and special ingredients. It is a proto-chemistry that expands to a comprehensive understanding of the workings of the multiverse. This is where the "bookish" scholarly flavor of the Wizard comes from.

The "Primal" Druid also does Elemental magic. But the Druid is communing with the Elemental forces − like mountains, rivers, storms, and sunshine − as individual persons, as well as transforming oneself into such Elemental forces.

Psionic magic is mind-over-matter, and making mindful wishes come true.

Divine magic is the power of words, symbols, and language − the words that cause creation to happen − and the multiverse is like a book that records information.

Each D&D Source is a different "theory of magic".

 

[RhaezDaevan]

Surprise!

The element of surprise is the most dangerous of all!

A devoted surprise mage school would be really fun to play though.

 

[Bohandas]

It would take me some time to track down the phrase, "fire that burns fire". It is one of the ways to distinguish the alchemical "fire" from the ordinary fire of a candle. The alchemical fire refers to the state of matter that prevails in the "heavens", beyond the earth. If I recall correctly, it derives from a biblical verse, where Elijah calls down fire from the heavens. This "fire from God" was able to eat the entire altar, including the burning offering itself that is rising up in fire, along with eating the wood and even the stones and the dust. The alchemists understood this verse to mean, this heavenly fire is a state of matter that is able to destroy any form of matter. It is unlike ordinary fire. The heavenly fire can burn fire.

That sounds like chlorine trifluoride/"substance n"

 

[Yaarel]

That sounds like chlorine trifluoride/"substance n"

I assume the biblical description has in mind a remarkably powerful lightning strike, that ionized the air (whence plasma), shattered the rock, vaporized the soil, and ignited the wood.

But the later alchemists also have in mind the nature of the sun and stars, somewhat correctly.

A meteorite can also unleash plasma.

In any case, the "heavenly" fire tends to be the state of matter, plasma.