D&D (2024) D&D species article

[Scribe]

I mean its frustrating, but with the tiniest bit of reorganization, the slightest hint of retcon, a list of 10 could easily have accounted for the Half-Orc and Half-Elf, added the Planetouched, included the Goliath, Orc, and yes Goblin, AND Gnome, and the 'core 4'.

It all seems pretty obvious to me, but the goal wasnt to 'expand the list' the goal was to remove Half-Orc and Half-Elf, as evidenced by the retcons in Phandelver for example.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I'm not sure about having the dragonborn breath weapon as part of the attack action - the timing seems fuzzy. Did we see more precise wording on this?

If it works like the Fizban's, the wording will something be this

Breath Weapon: When you take the Attack action on your turn, you can replace one of your attacks with an exhalation of magical energy in a 30-foot line that is 5 feet wide. Each creature in that area must make a Dexterity saving throw (DC = 8 + your Constitution modifier + your proficiency bonus). On a failed save, the creature takes 1d10 damage of the type associated with your Chromatic Ancestry. On a successful save, it takes half as much damage. This damage increases by 1d10 when you reach 5th level (2d10), 11th level (3d10), and 17th level (4d10).
You can use your Breath Weapon a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus, and you regain all expended uses when you finish a long rest.

I'm not sure of the timing issue you might have. Instead of rolling a d20 to make an attack roll, use the breath weapon instead.

 

[Chaosmancer]

The entire point of the discussion is how things should change. Stop trying to strawman.

Not really. Not only are the 2024 rules finished and printed, but the community had this entire debate over Strength scores between halflings and Orcs/Goliaths in 2020, and about every six months ever since.

Feel free to pursue your bliss by making your own homebrew rules that "totally fix everything" but the direction of DnD is fairly well set at this point. Maybe try again when the next major rules update comes out in 2034.

 

[Zuranthium]

The next rules update will be in 2028, 5.5 is just a money grab to hold them over until they need to make serious changes in the face of rising competitors.

 

[mamba]

Ability scores should absolutely be racially modified. Halflings and Gnomes clearly have a lower ceiling for muscle strength than most other races. Ogres clearly have a MUCH higher ceiling. Humans are clearly more intelligent than Dogs, and other races can certainly be more intelligent than Humans. Let's not pretend otherwise.

I'd be careful with INT, WIS and CHA, but for the other three I agree that some species are just better than others

It sucks how homogenous they've made things now, not just in this instance but also with things like: forcing all spell preparation to be the same, pushing most every class into being a caster of some sort, all spellcasting working regardless of armor, "cantrips are unlimited and everything else is a spell slot" as the only way for magic to exist (and with generally the same durations/mechanics across spell types), insisting every class has to follow the exact same structure of picking a subclass at Level 3, with exactly 4 options each. The game design keeps moving more towards "wannabe World of Warcraft" and away from "imaginative fantasy novel".

I do not like that almost everyone uses spells because I prefer a lower magic / more gritty setting, but I am not bothered by things being spells. I e.g. never saw psionics as anything but spells playing dress-up.

 

[mamba]

Ability score adjustments for species aren't good. Ability scores don't enough unless they are vastly different.

A 18 Str Orc and a 14 Str Halfling don't really have that much of a different in actual strength. It only affects classes IE fun.

Instead every race should have traits that modify their formula and stats.

probably better, because otherwise things would get too out of control if you wanted to truly express the difference in attribute points

 

[Zuranthium]

I do not like that almost everyone uses spells because I prefer a lower magic / more gritty setting, but I am not bothered by things being spells. I e.g. never saw psionics as anything but spells playing dress-up.

I'm fine with everything being considered spells (aside from Ranger abilities), the problem is it's all handled the same way. Each casting class should be very different, but they all use the same mechanics, right down to having exactly the same amount of spellslots for most of the major casting classes.

 

[mamba]

The next rules update will be in 2028, 5.5 is just a money grab to hold them over until they need to make serious changes in the face of rising competitors.

Too early, by then we barely got our first ... of Everything book

 

[Minigiant]

The entire point of the discussion is how things should change. Stop trying to strawman.

The game even in the future is not going in that direction.

Ability scores and ability modifiers are poor choices to display the difference between races in a TTRPG because the formula required to make it matter if too complex for in-person play.

First of all, if you read the rules I wrote, a halfling would not be higher than 12 STR, and likely an Orc melee character would be 20 STR, since having +2 STR bonus and assigning a base of 18 STR at character creation is frequently going to be the reason they picked that race.

In one instance the halfling might roll higher but on average it would be the orc winning those rolls much more often. Hence, a significant differentiation. And in the less common instances where a low stat character happens to beat a high stat character, it usually creates nice comedy at the table.

That doesn't address my point.

The number one problem with ability score modifiers in the modern state is.

The d20. ​

​

Until your total modifier is about 1/3 of the size of the dice you are rolling (for the d20 that's +7), The d20 overpowers whatever modifies you have.

When modifiers are small you're just rolling the die against the difficulty class.

This is why first edition and second edition really didn't use ability scores to do anything except for requirements and prerequisites.

Gygax and Arneson used charts because charts gave you the exact results you want to create. The drawback of charts of course is you need to have the chart available at all times in order to use it it can't just go off a memory like a modifier.

Hot take: ability modifiers are bad mechanics for anything except for repeated combat roles.

If you want a species to be strong or fast you need to write the rules and formula that they are strong or fast.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I'd be careful with INT, WIS and CHA, but for the other three I agree that some species are just better than others


I do not like that almost everyone uses spells because I prefer a lower magic / more gritty setting, but I am not bothered by things being spells. I e.g. never saw psionics as anything but spells playing dress-up.

I always appreciated different mechanics for psionics. I liked 1e and 2e more than 3e and 4e. Level Up's psionics (both versions) are excellent.