D&D (2024) Poll) Will the DMG2024 have Infinite Quivers?

[Micah Sweet]

Arrow tracking matters if your D&D game is about dungeon survival or emergent gameplay.

Arrow tracking doesn't matter if your D&D game is about monster fighting or storytelling, though.

An infinite quiver as a magic item makes a lot of sense, but it'd only really be valuable to the first group (and it'd be worth an Uncommon ranking so that it wasn't commonly available, and maybe have a chance of not working to add some tension to it). The second group is just going to waive the need to track arrows entirely from the get-go, making an infinite quiver a fairly redundant item that provides no real benefit.

Patching one kind of game into another kind of game via magic items is not a great idea. Better just to discuss resource management in general in the DMG and let groups decide for themselves for a particular adventure if they care about it or not.

That said, even tough D&D24 leans into monster fighting and storytelling a bit more than dungeon survival and emergent gameplay (light is a cantrip, after all), I wouldn't be surprised to find an infinite quiver in there. And it will be useless in campaigns that don't track arrows. And campaigns that DO track arrows might just not hand it out. So I don't imagine it will see much use in practice, if it's in there.

What do you mean by "tough" D&D24? What exactly makes it tough?

 

[I'm A Banana]

What do you mean by "tough" D&D24? What exactly makes it tough?

Misspelled "though"

 

[Steampunkette]

Ammunition Dice are a great, simple, solution which keeps the possibility of running out while deeply streamlining the ammo tracking process.

Start with 1d4. For every X Gold pieces you increase the die size by 1 up to 1d12. When you make a ranged attack, roll your Ammo die. On a 1, the die shrinks one step.

1d12: 8.33% chance of shrinking.
1d10: 10% chance of shrinking.
1d8: 12.5%% chance of shrinking.
1d6: 16.6% chance of shrinking.
1d4: 25% chance of shrinking.

Good gauge of how low you are on arrows without having to track them individually. Any time you find a "Pile of Arrows" you go up a die size.

Also makes Magic Ammo more fun to have/find. Since it's not "10 +1 Arrows" it's a 1d8 Ammo Die of +1 Arrows.

 

[Horwath]

I'm not for endless quiver, but I am for magic quiver that can store large amounts of ammo, like 200+ arrows.
And that you can draw whatever ammo you have in for it's specialized use.
maybe add Magic weapon 1/day for 20 arrows.

 

[Charlaquin]

Ammunition Dice are a great, simple, solution which keeps the possibility of running out while deeply streamlining the ammo tracking process.

Start with 1d4. For every X Gold pieces you increase the die size by 1 up to 1d12. When you make a ranged attack, roll your Ammo die. On a 1, the die shrinks one step.

1d12: 8.33% chance of shrinking.
1d10: 10% chance of shrinking.
1d8: 12.5%% chance of shrinking.
1d6: 16.6% chance of shrinking.
1d4: 25% chance of shrinking.

Good gauge of how low you are on arrows without having to track them individually. Any time you find a "Pile of Arrows" you go up a die size.

Also makes Magic Ammo more fun to have/find. Since it's not "10 +1 Arrows" it's a 1d8 Ammo Die of +1 Arrows.

Yep, great mechanic. I'd recommend capping a quiver at a d10 ammunition die though. That's around 28 shots from a full quiver on average, pretty close to the 30 you get from a quiver of 20 arrows and recovering half of your used arrows after each combat, as per RAW. Each die size increase would cost 25 SP, so going from empty to full costs a total of 1gp, same as the cost of 20 arrows. Crossbow bolts work the same. Sling bullets cap at a d10 die and cost 1cp each.

Blowgun needles are a bit trickier, since the 50 needle bag doesn't translate as evenly. But if you let it go up to a d12 ammo die (about 40 uses on average) and charge 5 sp per die, two full bags ends up costing 5 gp. So carrying two bags gets you 5 more shots on average than RAW for the same price.

If you allow firearms, cap them at a d6 (10 shots on average) and charge 15 sp per die. Technically that cheats the player of 5 shots per pouchfull of bullets, since 2024 RAW fails to specify that firearm ammunition is destroyed after use, so by RAW it can be recovered same as any other ammunition. But that's obviously an oversight since they copied the firearm and ammunition pricing from the 2014 DMG, which does specify that it's destroyed. If you'd prefer to stick closer to 2024 RAW for some reason, give them a d8 ammo die and charge 1gp each. They get 3 bonus shots for the same price as RAW that way, but close enough for government work.

 

[Bacon Bits]

My vote is that there will be infinite quivers, but they will inexplicably only contain crossbow bolts.

 

[Charlaquin]

Yep, great mechanic. I'd recommend capping a quiver at a d10 ammunition die though. That's around 28 shots from a full quiver on average, pretty close to the 30 you get from a quiver of 20 arrows and recovering half of your used arrows after each combat, as per RAW. Each die size increase would cost 25 SP, so going from empty to full costs a total of 1gp, same as the cost of 20 arrows. Crossbow bolts work the same. Sling bullets cap at a d10 die and cost 1cp each.

Blowgun needles are a bit trickier, since the 50 needle bag doesn't translate as evenly. But if you let it go up to a d12 ammo die (about 40 uses on average) and charge 5 sp per die, two full bags ends up costing 5 gp. So carrying two bags gets you 5 more shots on average than RAW for the same price.

If you allow firearms, cap them at a d6 (10 shots on average) and charge 15 sp per die. Technically that cheats the player of 5 shots per pouchfull of bullets, since 2024 RAW fails to specify that firearm ammunition is destroyed after use, so by RAW it can be recovered same as any other ammunition. But that's obviously an oversight since they copied the firearm and ammunition pricing from the 2014 DMG, which does specify that it's destroyed. If you'd prefer to stick closer to 2024 RAW for some reason, give them a d8 ammo die and charge 1gp each. They get 3 bonus shots for the same price as RAW that way, but close enough for government work.

Oh, and for the Efficient Quiver magic item (assuming it still works like it did in 2014), give it 3 compartments that can each hold up to a d10 of arrows or bolts, one compartment that can hold up to a d8 die of javelins (3 gp per die to fill), one compartment that can hold a d4 die of spears (4 gp to fill), one compartment that can hold a bow, and one compartment that can hold a quarterstaff.

 

[Xeviat]

I think, technically speaking, nothing can have infinite weight because weight depends on the force of gravity on the object and at some point it becomes the centre of the force of gravity and then weighs nothing.

Wait, does the sun weigh nothing?

 

[Peter BOSCO'S]

Yes, but I think it's pretty clear they meant infinite mass.

If we were using real world physics I would have said mass, but this is Dungeons & Dragons, and we are talking about infinite arrows, so I specifically chose not to use scientific terms. YMMV.

 

[CleverNickName]

Patching one kind of game into another kind of game via magic items is not a great idea. Better just to discuss resource management in general in the DMG and let groups decide for themselves for a particular adventure if they care about it or not.

This is the best comment so far.

Seriously, just talk about it with your gaming group.