D&D 5E The 2024 Ranger is Actually Pretty Good (with numbers)

[Chaosmancer]

And so, your character is an archer with a poor dex.

Other players: “Why does your character suck Bob?”

When people want a melee character, they will recruit a barbarian, fighter or even a monk. “Ranged” might be a false entomology for Ranger, but nevertheless it has a powerful effect on expectations.

I tell them that if they wanted an archer in the party, they should have rolled an archer. My character concept may be shaped by the groups needs, but that is MY choice to make at character creation. You may as well hand me a pre-gen if you are going to let other dictate what an acceptable build is.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I mean, ranger sure works better at range.
Kind of a bad design to have forced concentration feature(8 instances of the feature over 20 levels) on a class that is somewhat expected to go to melee without any help with holding concentration.

Sorcerer has basically 2 build in options for Concentration.

1. Con saves by default
2. Ability to take extend spell at 2nd level for meager 1 sorcery point.

ranger has:
1. "cricket noises"
2. "prays for 6th level paladin in a party"

Clerics who choose protector order and use heavy armor and melee weapons
Druids who choose Warden order and use heavy armor and melee weapons, Moon Druids specifically
Valor and Dance bards.

It isn't like melee and concentration spells is some bizarre confluence of events that has only ever happened to a ranger. So, guess all those concepts are dead in the water with bad design too?

 

[Ashrym]

Druids who choose Warden order and use heavy armor

I think you misspoke.

Druids have training in light armor and shields. Warden upgrades to medium armor.

 

[Clint_L]

When people want a melee character, they will recruit a barbarian, fighter or even a monk. “Ranged” might be a false entomology for Ranger, but nevertheless it has a powerful effect on expectations.

This comment seems odd to me - it's like a comment I would see on the World of Warcraft forums, where people are looking for optimal group composition to run a raid or something.

But D&D is usually played by groups of friends who are looking to build a good story together. We aren't recruiting strangers to fill a party niche. Don't most groups support whatever each player wants to play?

If someone wants to play a ranger, my response would be "cool." Same as any other class. I would put the current iteration of ranger as one of the weaker classes at single target DPS, but it's still a good class overall.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

This comment seems odd to me - it's like a comment I would see on the World of Warcraft forums, where people are looking for optimal group composition to run a raid or something

Maybe so, but I have seen so many encounters where the party has been massacred because they are incompetent at long range that it becomes tiresome to have to dumb down encounters (spells do not have the range of bows). If the ranger isn’t going to cover that, who is? I’m not saying that all rangers must be Dex builds, I’m just refuting the claim that wisdom builds are the only viable build, because wisdom builds are poor at range. Even in a regular encounter, ranged characters probably get in one more attack than melee. This white room assumption that all encounters occur at melee range is garbage.

I haven’t seen many rangers played in 5e, but I one we did have pivoted from melee to archery because they found range was such a huge advantage.

 

[Horwath]

Clerics who choose protector order and use heavy armor and melee weapons
Druids who choose Warden order and use heavy armor and melee weapons, Moon Druids specifically
Valor and Dance bards.

It isn't like melee and concentration spells is some bizarre confluence of events that has only ever happened to a ranger. So, guess all those concepts are dead in the water with bad design too?

And how many of those classes are given extra uses of spells that use Concentration?
War domain has a option to ignore concentration, moon druid gets wis bonus to Conc saves if moon druid CHOOSES to have concentration used while in melee.

Ranger really has no choice, either use the ability and hope no one attacks you or ignore certain part of your class budget that is spent on giving you bonus HM.

that is why I say that Shillelagh is almost a non brainer for a ranger to get via origin.
It uses Wis for attacks and wis is used for almost all Ranger features, and warcaster is then logical 1st choice at 4th level as it guards your HM feature and increases your now MAIN ability.

now, if there is an option to take +1 dex with Warcaster it would help with ranger build.
same with GWM, +1 dex on that so you can use bonus damage on your longbow, sure, it sucks that you will not use Cleave part 99% of the time, but at least your primary ability wont suffer if you pick it.

Then with +1 DEX for warcaster and GWM and +1 for SS, you can get good damage and have decent Conc.
And with 16 wis, you will get decent effect from ranger features and spells.

 

[Clint_L]

Maybe so, but I have seen so many encounters where the party has been massacred because they are incompetent at long range that it becomes tiresome to have to dumb down encounters (spells do not have the range of bows).

This seems like a DM problem.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

This seems like a DM problem.

It is a DM problem. I would rather not have to make enemies congenitally stupid, or have NPCs come to the rescue, just because the enemies use sensible tactics. It's not much fun if the DM's biggest challenge is "how can I make these enemies dumb enough for the players to have a chance?", and it's not much fun for the DM to say "you all die like Boromir game over" either.

Ever played BG3, or even BG1? Bows absolutely massacre, because when you take the battlefield into account it matters more that you can reach your target than how much damage you do if you can manage to hit them.

And concentration? Stay out of reach and behind cover and you won't get hit, so won't need to make concentration checks.

 

[Ashrym]

And how many of those classes are given extra uses of spells that use Concentration?

TBF, domain spells, circle spells, and magical secrets offer plenty of concentration spells in addition to those class lists. Favored Enemy allows for dropping concentration on Hunter's Mark because the free uses means it can easily be recast.

Hunter's Mark can be up most of the time. Just not all of the time if the ranger chooses to use another concentration spell.

 

[Horwath]

TBF, domain spells, circle spells, and magical secrets offer plenty of concentration spells in addition to those class lists. Favored Enemy allows for dropping concentration on Hunter's Mark because the free uses means it can easily be recast.

Hunter's Mark can be up most of the time. Just not all of the time if the ranger chooses to use another concentration spell.

added list is not the same as given usage and can't be equal. It's not like that is the ONLY spell of that level you can cast.

also, why does Favored enemy has 8 instances over 20 levels of Ranger?
Talk about overkill on focusing an entire class on a single (low level) feature.
A spell that is not that great to begin with and no one really likes the spell.