D&D 5E What Makes 5E "5E"?

[Chaltab]

I can't really comment on Shadowdark and Demon Lord because I don't have copies of them but like I said I think the core engine of 5E is:

• The D&D staple mechanics of Ability Scores 3-18 and d20 resolution rolls
• Proficiency bonus with limited scaling that applies universally to anything you're proficient with
• Bounded accuracy
• Advantage and Disadvantage in place of most numeric bonuses and penalties
• An action economy that treats movement as a fluid and actions as solids.
• Plain language instead of keywords and symbols

 

[Garthanos]

Simulacrum army has always been the Pun-Pun of 5e trotted out as an example of how broken the rules are but never actually seen in any game.

In general 5e is careless design (and cannot even blame huge amounts of products being produced this is 1 book) heavily favoring casters (even just doubling nearly your entire inventory of spells is insane - the army part is gravy on the goose and is not doing any thing particularly tricky either).

But you have fun with your casters rule and martials drool edition part 2. I am not impressed.

 

[Garthanos]

Then have them do it repeatedly it all day long

Tell me how often that is useful and interesting in a story that is? I mean when does it ever come up in D&D and tell me how much grander their constitution is wait nope its not particularly any better (esp if the caster is defending that concentration) and how much are you betting the DM deciding they were running long distance would not say they must use a Constitution check to avoid heavily depleting exhaustion. Your casters are godlings and your martials are boring as hell and you pretend game simplifications to avoid tedium (D&D the game where we count calories and lactic acid build up) is some wonderous "feature".

Bah unimpressive. (the dash movement isnt even fast its trudging)

 

[Garthanos]

That’s not really a unique issue or motivation for 3e considering it was a cited reason for 2e as well. So, I’m not really sure how interesting their statements are to that effect.

I just found 2e to be way too close to just 1e with minor tweaks at the time and 3e really did seem to do a structural over haul.

 

[Oofta]

In general 5e is careless design (and cannot even blame huge amounts of products being produced this is 1 book) heavily favoring casters (even just doubling nearly your entire inventory of spells is insane - the army part is gravy on the goose and is not doing any thing particularly tricky either).

But you have fun with your casters rule and martials drool edition part 2. I am not impressed.

Ah, the refreshing negative spin putting things in the worst light possible. Have fun with dissing the game this forum is dedicated to and that I, and millions of others, have gotten countless hours of enjoyment from. I am not impressed.

In other words if you don't like D&D play something else. Why go to a forum dedicated to the game just to yuck on people's yum?

 

[Oofta]

Tell me how often that is useful and interesting in a story that is? I mean when does it ever come up in D&D and tell me how much grander their constitution is wait nope its not particularly any better (esp if the caster is defending that concentration) and how much are you betting the DM deciding they were running long distance would not say they must use a Constitution check to avoid heavily depleting exhaustion. Your casters are godlings and your martials are boring as hell and you pretend game simplifications to avoid tedium (D&D the game where we count calories and lactic acid build up) is some wonderous "feature".

Bah unimpressive. (the dash movement isnt even fast its trudging)

Tell me why you give a crap about what I enjoy in a game? If I wanted a character that could split a mountain in twain with a sword I'd play something else. Meanwhile the 20th level fighters are a bit of a tortoise to a hair, but they contribute just as much to the game as the caster in my game. It's a vastly different story than it was in older versions of the game.

No game can be for everyone.

 

[Reynard]

I think this is a deeper conversation than what makes 5E different than 4E or 3E or B/X or whatever edition of D&D you're into.

It's also about the numerous games that have come out in the last 10 years that are in response to or adjacent to or borrowing from 5E.

Reynard mentioned Shadowdark. I'm thinking of Shadow of the Demon Lord. He believes those are not really 5E, despite some similar mechanics. I think they are.

I'd be interested to hear what others think about games that aren't 5E but share some mechanics or influences.

For clarity, I did not make a judgement about SotDL. I own it and have read it and love it's aesthetic, but unfortunately have never been able to pull together a one shot to test it out. I don't know how close or far from 5E it plays.

I have run a LOT of Shadowdark and it does not run anything like 5E outside of adv/disadv. The characters don't feel the same, the monsters don't feel the same, and the play processes don't feel the same.

I think a lot of people play SD like 5E, and I think they are "doing it wrong."

 

[TiQuinn]

For clarity, I did not make a judgement about SotDL. I own it and have read it and love it's aesthetic, but unfortunately have never been able to pull together a one shot to test it out. I don't know how close or far from 5E it plays.

I have run a LOT of Shadowdark and it does not run anything like 5E outside of adv/disadv. The characters don't feel the same, the monsters don't feel the same, and the play processes don't feel the same.

I think a lot of people play SD like 5E, and I think they are "doing it wrong."

Yeah, I’ve heard it described as 5e as well and yet the playstyle is so different that I feel the description is misleading to most players. It has a couple of similar mechanics that will feel familiar but that can be deceiving as the game is far swingier.

 

[Micah Sweet]

I just found 2e to be way too close to just 1e with minor tweaks at the time and 3e really did seem to do a structural over haul.

Since I played 1e more than any other edition and loved it, 2e being mostly more (a lot more) of the same in terms of compatible mechanics was exactly what I wanted. And 2e expanded (without substantially contradicting) the game's lore. 2e was a win-win for me.

 

[Remathilis]

We did character generation last night for my new campaign and we discovered another thing that is a strong 5E-ism: the common straight up nonsensical and/or contradictory writing of spells, feats, class abilities and rules. Lol.

That's just D&D going all the way back to the White Box.