D&D 5E Guns and D&D - are we doing it wrong? An alternative

Lord Shark

Adventurer
Man a lot of folks get really granular with this.

Like…do you have different draw weights and materials and constructions of bows, as well?

When someone has a gun in my game, it’s just another weapon. It isn’t deadlier, it’s just a simple weapon so more likely to be in the hands of conscripts and randos.

Yeah, the "problems" with guns come up when you start treating them like Wands of Instant Death and then feel you have to balance them with long reload times, expensive ammunition, etc., until they become useless and no fun.

Meanwhile, in most fantasy media that includes guns, they're just a weapon like any other.
 

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Vaalingrade

Legend
Yeah, the "problems" with guns come up when you start treating them like Wands of Instant Death and then feel you have to balance them with long reload times, expensive ammunition, etc., until they become useless and no fun.

Meanwhile, in most fantasy media that includes guns, they're just a weapon like any other.
Bingo!

This plus the trend of extra-versimilituding guns vs other weapons that get to be abstract keep them from integrating well into the game.

It doesn't help that 5e has so many fewer handles you can manipulate to make a firearm different from a crossbow or bow. In 3x, I gave them lower damager but a higher crit range. In 4e, I made them Brutal ranged. In 5e... Better... range?
 

CleverNickName

Limit Break Dancing
In a game where every class has access to damage cantrip on par with crossbow and Wand of Magic Missile is uncommon item, early guns are obsolete. TBH, even crossbows are obsolete. I can't remember someone actually used one in the game. You eather go with archer build or just spam cantrips which have damage scaling with character level. So guns need to do something extra. I would stick with ignoring non magical armor and defenses.

For more steampunkish version, i would just use wand of magic missile and refluff it to 1d6+1 but no auto hit, 7 charges and that's it. Recharge to full after Long rest. Why only 7 charges? Gun has enough steam under pressure for 7 shots, then you need to refill it and steam pump takes time to build up needed amount. Same with rifle, just use d10. With that, you can have it with burst and full auto mode. Burst- 3 charges in one action, full auto- all 7 charges in one action. So, you give player option do lay down suppressive fire, unload on multiple creatures nearby.
I like this idea. I like this a lot.

A musket or pistol could just be a really large, really heavy wand of firebolts. You have to "attune" to it (spend a short or long rest adjusting the flint, setting the sights, cleaning the bore and frizzen, etc.) and you have to spend material components (balls of lead and a small amount of black powder) each time it's fired. As you become more practiced and familiar with the weapon (gain levels), you're able to deal more damage on a hit.
1709312610557.png

Wand of Firebolts?

A pepperbox could be a reskinned wand of eldritch blast: as you gain levels, you become more proficient and you're able to squeeze off more shots in a round.

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Wand of Eldritch Blast?
 

Minigiant

Legend
Supporter
Bingo. When you add guns to a D&D type fantasy game it really takes me out of the setting. And I realize this is just a preference on my part rather than a desire for realism.
Guns work in D&D. Works for Warhammer Fantasy and it's more brutal that D&D

It just matters on how you expect them to run.

It's like swords. We assume the knight and orc chief and parrying blade thrust and having their swords bounce off their armors.

Party fest like Swashbuckling?
Armorfest like Epic Fantasy?
Meatfest like Sword and Sorcery?
Dodgefest like Anime?
 

MGibster

Legend
Guns work in D&D. Works for Warhammer Fantasy and it's more brutal that D&D
They don't work in D&D for me because it's not my preference. They work fine in Warhammer though because Warhammer isn't D&D. If guns in D&D work for you, that's great. I'm sure not going to harsh your mellow. I don't like them in D&D though.
 

Have you players any battle royal or survival videogame where the PC has to find a firearms to face other shooters?

If firearms are possible in D&D then players wouldn't play more with classes focused to hand-to-hand combat: paladins, barbarians, monks..

I would bet Hasbro is wishing to can add no-fantasy franchises into D&D multiverse, for example Gamma World.

You could be forgottin something, the enemy gunslingers. If the firearms are so powerful, then the challenge rating or XP reward shouldn't be the same when an humanoid enemy can use firearms. Let's imagine a battle royal videogame where you start with melee weapons.. and later your enemy use crossbows, guns, and later machine guns. It would be the same monster stats, but one are easier or harder than others.
 


Stormonu

Legend
Used to hate guns in my D&D, but since the first appearance of the arquebuese in 2E, and then later A Mighty Fortress, they've been sneaking into some of my games. My own homebrew has a nation that's just starting to use them and their creation is kept a closely guarded secret via geas and curses. Lately, I've built a couple campaign ideas including them from the get-go where they're much more common.

I'm somewhat partial to the 2E rules, they do d4 to d10 damage, but when you roll max damage you roll an additional die (also referred to as 'exploding die'). Otherwise, they're very loud crossbows that come with their own fog cloud.
 

I'm A Banana

Potassium-Rich
Guns - how to incorporate them in a D&D game?
Man, if there ever was a thing tied to genre expectations in D&D, it's the boomstick.

For that reason, I think a diversity of answers is probably the best.

I'm a big fan of your proposal here. In 5e terms, we'd maybe load your firearm as part of a short or long rest. Works real well.

But, like, in a magitech setting like Eberron, maybe a "gun" just fires magical force bullets and works pretty much exactly like a crossbow.

And in a more "authentic" medievalesque setting, maybe we treat guns as one-off custom items capable of catastrophic damage and armor piercing but not really something a PC is meant to wield on a regular basis (more like a consumable magic item than like a sword or a bow).
 

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