Pineapple Express: Someone Is Wrong on the Internet?

Scribe said:

Nothing new under the sun, so I'm told.

I just wish I could tolerate reading a PDF. I don't know what it is but I struggle quite a bit.

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Same, but I do find PDFs helpful for quick look ups during a game or to have ready reference when I'm on the road or otherwise away from my books. For crunchy games I really like and play a lot, like WFRP, I've bought the PDF, physical, and VTT versions of the same book more often than I would like to admit. I like different formats for different purposes.

RealAlHazred said:

I'm (laboriously) reading* a copy of Casus Belli magazine from October 1984 (#22), and I come across an article called "Formules ou Tables?" (Formulas or Tables?) and, sure enough, the author has ascending AC and provides a table to find the attack bonus based on class and level. This isn't some small magazine -- this was basically The Dragon magazine for francophone gamers.

I'm just constantly amused that "New School innovations" that have "spoiled D&D" greatly predate 3rd edition. So many of them do...

* I mean, Google Translate does a lot of the heavy lifting, but it always requires interpretation when it comes to gaming terminology...

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The first draft of OD&D used a formula rather than tables.

overgeeked said:

They almost added ascending AC to 2E but chickened out. Most if not all the changes were house rules lots of people were already using for years by the time 2E rolled around.

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Gary also indicated in the 1E DMG that he considered switching to ascending, but kept the old way because existing players were all used to it.

Page 164: "Because prior game forms worked from a high base number (9) upwards, I have opted to follow the same progression herein for the sake of continuity and familiarity."

--

Man, I've carried the torch for a particular gaming issue for a long time before, but you are unhinged on this topic. In all seriousness, get some perspective.

I have questions and concerns

Mannahnin said:

Gary also indicated in the 1E DMG that he considered switching to ascending, but kept the old way because existing players were all used to it.

Page 164: "Because prior game forms worked from a high base number (9) upwards, I have opted to follow the same progression herein for the sake of continuity and familiarity."

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Zeno: Achilles, why aren't you using the +2 shield that your fighter found?

Achilles: Don't take Lord Kronan the off-brand Barbarian for a fool! Kronan isn't using that cursed shield. BY KROM, I WILL NOT SULLY MYSELF WITH YOUR DARK MAGICKS, WIZARD!

Zeno: .... uh .... it's a +2 shield. It's not cursed. I ... sorry, McNulty O'Cult identified the shield! It's not cursed. It's a +2 shield.

Achilles: Listen up, O'Cult! I don't need any of your thaumatur... um... thoughtmaturdy... grrrr. KRONAN WILL NOT FALL YOUR EVIL MAGICKS AGAIN! Do you think you can fool me into changing my AC from a 4 to a 6? KROM WILL SMITE YOU FOR YOUR INSOLENCE!!!!

Zeno: Wait, what? ....oh. OH! No, Achilles. It's a +2 shield. That means it is -2 to your AC, not +2.

Achilles: Do you think Kronan is so simple minded? Are you trying to make me a laughing stock with your +2 shield now, or have you been laughing at me this entire time when my +2 longsword has been subtracting two from every beast I have attempted to slay?

Zeno: No! No. O'Cult would never lie. See, a +2 shield is -2, and a +2 sword is ... +2.

Achilles: HO! So the +2 shield is -2 to my saving throws? You wish to eat my charred flesh when the dragon breath turns Kronan into Kronan Nuggets?

Zeno: No, no no. See, it's -2 to AC, but +2 to saving throws.

Achilles: I do not understand your words Wizard. Your words and your maths make no sense! You speak in riddles. Like when you told me that you were level 3, and therefore could not cast a level 3 spell, when we were on level 3 of the dungeon.

Zeno: ....eh, you may have a point.

Another hype video for a local BT tourney im running next month.

Not my best work, but I got lazy and said "good enough!" Just didnt feel like doing that voice over more than 2-3x...

Snarf Zagyg said:

Achilles: I do not understand your words Wizard. Your words and your maths make no sense! You speak in riddles. Like when you told me that you were level 3, and therefore could not cast a level 3 spell, when we were on level 3 of the dungeon.

Zeno: ....eh, you may have a point.

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When I was a middle-school kid trying to learn D&D, I just assumed the math was deliberately obtuse, to make sure that only "older kids" would be able to play it. The way I saw it, that complicated math was intended to be a rite of passage (at best), or a bar to entry (at worst). So we made up our own math and our own rules, as kids will do.

But now I'm an adult with an engineering degree and I can confirm, yes, that was probably the case. And our solution is still the best recommended course of action.

CleverNickName said:

When I was a middle-school kid trying to learn D&D, I just foolishly assumed the math was deliberately obtuse, to make sure that only "older kids" would be able to play it. The complicated math was intended to be a rite of passage (at best), or a bar to entry (at worst). So we made up our own math and our own rules, as kids will do.

But now I'm an adult with an engineering degree and I can confirm, yes, that was probably the case. And our solution is still the best recommended course of action.

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Weird. I have the exact same chain of thought when it comes to the language used in certain threads!

Snarf Zagyg said:

Zeno: Wait, what? ....oh. OH! No, Achilles. It's a +2 shield. That means it is -2 to your AC, not +2.

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-3!

Y'know... If I'm googling something, filling the entire first page of results with stuff behind a paywall or that requires me to turn off my ad-blocker is... unhelpful.