D&D General 2024 Monster Creation

[M_Natas]

I disagree. Monster creation rules that are an improved version of the 2014 ones would be generally well received.

Part of this would involve possible math tweaks and expanded/improved lists of monster traits.

The other part would be presentation. It needs to be easier to use. As it is now one of the main criticisms people appear to have is that the hp numbers on the chart are too high, which is based on misunderstanding the chart. You almost always end up with significantly lower hp at the end due to adjustments from AC and monster traits. That is all explained if you just read the instructions.

The problem is, that it was one chart. So for example it is impossible to Show how mathematically the HP would have to be adjusted if you lower or raise the AC. So every CR 0 to CR 3 monster has AC 13 ...

But 100HP with AC 13 is, from a challenge point of view the same as AC 10 with 133HP or AC 16 with 66 HP.

If the party has an average attack bonus of +3.

In this case, it appears to be an identical issue as the organization of the DMG. Despite basically everything in the 2024 DMG except bastions already being in the 2014 DMG--along with things people actually used that didn't make it to the 2024 like some of the optional rules--the 2024 is treated as a huge improvement just because of its more accessible organization.

The problem for me so far is that only the organisation seems better.
The old content they took from the 2014 dmg they made worse:

• removed mentioning adventure day, so new DMs don't know that 5e is balanced around 6 to 8 medium encounters in-between long rests.
• removed monster building rules and just left "reskinning" in

And what they added I feel is subpar (Bastion rules, the Campaign sheet templates ...).

 

[Clint_L]

...removed mentioning adventure day, so new DMs don't know that 5e is balanced around 6 to 8 medium encounters in-between long rests.

They don't mention it because it isn't true and never has been, as they stated very openly and directly (see the relevant video, linked on this sub-forum). The 6-8 encounter day was always a myth for how most folks played 5e, and so we didn't build encounters around it.

I build each encounter basically assuming the party has most of their resources. I seldom have more than one encounter in an adventuring day, but it will have a lot of moving parts.

 

[pemerton]

I made so many photocopies of that blank monster page, and filled in dozens of homemade monsters when I was 10-11 years old. Hah. I had noooo idea what I was doing, but that didn't stop me!

I still have the first-ever AD&D monster I "designed":

Spoiler

Spirit

Frequency: Rare
No. Appearing" 2-9
Armour Class: 4
Move: 15"
Hit Dice: 3
% in Lair: 10%
Treasure Type: Q, Y, 10% for magic, see below
No. of Attack: 1
Damage/Attack: 1-12
Special Attacks: Breath
Special Defence: See below
Magic Resistance: See below
Intelligence: Very
Alignment: Lawful Evil
Size: M (6' tall)
Psionic Ability: Nil
Attack/Defence Modes: Nil
Monster Mark: 1144/135 x hp

Spirits are undead, appearing as cloaked men, but with no visible body, only glowing red eyes in a black space. They attack with a sword of chilling flame, which does 1-12 points of damage. It disappears with the death of the spirit, being part of the creature's essence, leaving only a hilt (which may be bejewelled (5%)). The spirts also have a paralysing breath, which will affect one creature within 5' every round. If a save is failed, the victim is paralysed for 2-5 rounds.

Spirits fight to the death. They are affected only by silver or magic weapons. They are immune to all poisons and to cold, paralysis or sleep magic, as well as that which affects the mind. Holy Water does 2-8 points per vial. They are destroyed by a raise dead spell if they fail a save vs magic.

They may be turned as Ghasts [this has been struck out and replaced by Wights]. When a spirit dies, all that is left is its cloak, and any gems or magic that are part of its treasure. The cloak will act as a Cloak of Poisonousness on anyone who dons it. Anyone slain by a spirit will return as a spirit in three night's time.

I will post a write-up of the 8 HD version - Spirit Stalker - only if popular acclaim so demands!

 

[Sword of Spirit]

The problem is, that it was one chart. So for example it is impossible to Show how mathematically the HP would have to be adjusted if you lower or raise the AC. So every CR 0 to CR 3 monster has AC 13 ...

But 100HP with AC 13 is, from a challenge point of view the same as AC 10 with 133HP or AC 16 with 66 HP.

If the party has an average attack bonus of +3.

The chart actually does work for that. Every time you increase or decrease AC by 2 points, it is equivalent to moving up or down one level on the hp line. Same thing with attack bonus and the damage line.

The chart requires the instructions to function--it isn't something you can just extract from the book and use all by itself. But the instructions are all there. In this case they are even on the same page under Defensive Challenge Rating and Offensive Challenge Rating.

Presentation and organization issues. I read the book front to back twice when I got it, but most people don't, so they need to make it easier to find the rules.

The problem for me so far is that only the organisation seems better.
The old content they took from the 2014 dmg they made worse:

• removed mentioning adventure day, so new DMs don't know that 5e is balanced around 6 to 8 medium encounters in-between long rests.
• removed monster building rules and just left "reskinning" in

And what they added I feel is subpar (Bastion rules, the Campaign sheet templates ...).

That's my impression too, though I haven't had a chance to read it yet.

 

[Stormonu]

Going back a few pages, I think the only "Monster Design Rules" that 1E/2E/BX had was basically based on HD, with notations ('*' in B/X) for special abilities that basically increased the effective HD/level. I remember the FF & MM2 of 1E had a "Level" designation where XP value was listed, indicating what Dungeon Level (and thus, what character level) a monster was appropriate for. The MM didn't have this value, but there was a section in the DMG (which was published after the MM) that had charts for the monsters that had the Level designation stated there.

The 2E DMG has a similar section (p 47) that bases monster difficulty on HD, with modifiers to the XP value/level based on a short list of different abilities the monster might have. There's not guidance on AC or DPR beyond the like of a few XP modifiers for certain thresholds (Immunity to any weapon is +1 HD modifier, Single attack dealing 20+ damage is a +2 HD modifier, Multiple attacks that deal 30+ damage is a +2 modifier as well). The Monstrous Manual has basic information how to fill out the blank monster sheet and points back to the information on DMG 47.