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D&D General 2nd edition player handbook class examples.
- Thread starter Shades of Eternity
- Start date
Chaltab
Legend
5E really doesn't scale that high. Even a Wizard with wish isn't doing a fraction of what Strange and Scarlet Witch can.
CreamCloud0
Hero
maybe the highest highs don't quite match but i feel there's a good amount of general overlap where MCU could provide a decent reference point for 5e characters.
Gotta really think.
For level 11, popular examples
Barbarian
Bard
Cleric
Druid
Fighter: Jamie Lannister (prime)
Monk: Master Roshi (Dragonball)
Paladin: Tommy Oliver (otherwise)
Ranger
Rogue: Black Widow
Sorcerer: Snape
Warlock: Tommy Oliver (evil Green Ranger)
Wizard: Harry Dresden (preMulticlassing)
roguish
the one who strays
It did name drop Robin Hood (as Ranger), Little John (as Fighter), Alan-a-Dale and Will Scarlett (as Bards), and Lancelot, Gawain, and Galahad (as Paladins). Not Arthur, Aragorn, or Conan though.
I'm ambivalent about these examples, because on one hand they were really cool and inspiring, but on the other hand they were brazen lies. Player Classes weren't based on these figures! Player Classes were a patchwork of ideas mostly plucked from ~1940s-1970s American and British sword and sorcery. If mythology and folklore came into it, it was indirectly: it went through the wringer and came out wrong, changed, unrecognisable. And to be clear, that's fine! Adapting and remixing older material over and over is how civilisation works, we're not supposed to put that stuff on a pedestal and never touch it.
However, namedropping mythical figures in the PHB set up some unreasonable expectations. Mages in myth and legend don't drop fireballs. You can't emulate Merlin, Circe, or Medea (2nd Edition's examples) with D&D rules.
So imo, picking historical and (ah) public domain examples, only marginally related to the classes, while excluding recent fantasy material that was MUCH more relevant, created a dissonance, at least in some cases.
There's also an issue with 2nd Edition's eurocentrism, but the PC examples are only a symptom, and I'm NOT getting into that. Just, you know. Let's not be blind to it, it's huge.
Sorry, I was going off of memory there on the examples. But yes, totally agree. D&D is its own type of fantasy and none of those characters could really be emulated in 2e. I still think overall, while sword and sorcery was an inspiration, D&D never really was about truly emulating any of those characters either.
GreyLord
Legend
TSR editions were more grounded overall. They would have you have heroes in the Range of King Arthur or Robin Hood or Charlemagne and his Paladins. They had their basis originally in the Historical Wargaming crowd and so their appeal stemed from that origin. These are people that prefer something that has some basis in real life and real ideas.
WotC has Superman and Thor as their basis of heroes. They are more fantastical and ply the crowds that love things like the overpowered anime heroes of Dragonball as your lowlevel characters, to the Overpowered Catperson that also has fairy wings and can fly around in space at will type high level play. In my opinion, though there is overlap, they are also two totally different types of audiences and two different types of crowds.
They want different things and want to play different types of games. One is more into the recreation of a historical setting with magic that integrates itself into it (fairy tales, arthurian legends, Lord of the Rings), while the other starts off fantastical right from the start (Xanth, Wizard of Oz) and ramps it up from there.
WotC has Superman and Thor as their basis of heroes. They are more fantastical and ply the crowds that love things like the overpowered anime heroes of Dragonball as your lowlevel characters, to the Overpowered Catperson that also has fairy wings and can fly around in space at will type high level play. In my opinion, though there is overlap, they are also two totally different types of audiences and two different types of crowds.
They want different things and want to play different types of games. One is more into the recreation of a historical setting with magic that integrates itself into it (fairy tales, arthurian legends, Lord of the Rings), while the other starts off fantastical right from the start (Xanth, Wizard of Oz) and ramps it up from there.
The Soloist
Hero
2e even had the Historical Reference Sourcebook. I own several of them.
9322 HR1 Vikings Campaign
9323 HR2 Charlemagne's Paladins
9376 HR3 Celts Campaign
9370 HR4 A Mighty Fortress Campaign
9425 HR5 The Glory of Rome Campaign
9408 HR6 Age of Heroes
9469 HR7 The Crusades
9322 HR1 Vikings Campaign
9323 HR2 Charlemagne's Paladins
9376 HR3 Celts Campaign
9370 HR4 A Mighty Fortress Campaign
9425 HR5 The Glory of Rome Campaign
9408 HR6 Age of Heroes
9469 HR7 The Crusades
Voadam
Legend
AD&D had plenty of representations of fictional exemplars who were high level in D&D stats. You just have to look in Deities & Demigods (1e) The series of recurring Down to Earth Heroes articles in Dragon, and 2e Legends & Lore.
Mostly they were baseline a bit above what PCs could do with better stats, multiple human classes, and one off powers.
The first hero statted out in the 1e and 2e god books is 15th level. The lowest level American Indian hero exemplar is 10th.
Mostly they were baseline a bit above what PCs could do with better stats, multiple human classes, and one off powers.
The first hero statted out in the 1e and 2e god books is 15th level. The lowest level American Indian hero exemplar is 10th.
I think the issue is that high level 2e PCs translate to low level 4e or 5e PCs
Hiawatha is maybe a 7th level ranger in 5e.
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